Long range TEAM hitting strategy

GunnerShotgun said:

If I were a college coach I would agree. If you are a HS coach and you get he players for 2.5-3 months out of the year how much of an impact do you really think you are making?

Perhaps your state and high school have different regulations so your situation is different (you have more access to your players).

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How much impact am I making?
I see my players for 3 hours a day, 6 days a week. So, let's look at the influence math. 24 days a month x 3 hours x 3 months equals 216 hours. Now, lets take an average travel ball team that practices 1 time a week for 52 weeks which equals 156 hours. Fundamental learning takes place in practice, not in games, therefore, HS coaches have more contact time with the athlete, thus a greater influence.

HS ball is unique, in that, HS coaches have a limited pool of participants. We are only allowed to select from athletes who attend our schools. With that, we may get, on average, 6 so-called travel/select players per team. The rest either come from Rec or have never played till HS.

In my travels, I continue to get athletes with poor throwing mechanics, outfielders who drift to the ball, batters who cast, batters who pull out early because they feel they need to "jack the ball", batters who's extension is toward third, rather than the pitcher, infielders who field the ball back between their feet, infielders who miss throws left and right because of cross body throwing, batters who watch first pitch strikes, bunters who can't see the bat and the ball or who can't place a bunt left or right, slappers who run away from the ball, pitchers who zero leg drive...the list goes on. For all the expert travel ball coaches who are making this tremendous impact, why do I see these things from my select players?

Just like there are some good and bad HS coaches, so too are there good and bad travel coaches. Let's not forget "Daddy Ball" coaches, parent in the stands coaches, teams that started because of conflict with an organization coaches, parents with blinders on coaches, etc... Now the Travel ball landscape is so watered down, that it seems even harder to find quality coaching happening.

How about this scenario, Coach of B level team goes to a C level tournament and whoops up on the competition. Now this coach is labeled a good coach and he/she is teaching these girls the right stuff. Go to a practice and observe, and this coach has a bat in one hand and a glove in the other. For hitting practice, front toss with one girl hitting while the rest shag. This coach is winning, so they must be good.

Sorry for the rant...I felt the need to defend HS coaches. It is a thankless job and I haven't met any HS coaches who weren't trying to help these student-athletes. They might not be the best, but they are giving of their time and energy. The same is true for their volunteer travel coaches.

I understand that the experience varies by location. The original question was with regards to "TEAM hitting" at the 16u level. My point was that "TEAM hitting" was an inefficient use of time at that level and that it would be better left to paid hitting coaches or parents that have more *time* with the individual hitters.

We are in a Top 10 softball state and the influence that the majority of high school coaches have on individual player skills is the least of all the sources. Travel softball plays way more games and practices more (your math is a little fuzzy). Having said that the individual hitting, pitching, or catching coach has more of an influence than travel coaches on those respective skill sets. Those are just my observations in my state.

I am not knocking any coach high school coach or otherwise, just stating what I observe.

I find it most interesting that with all of these voices that we churn out high level players at all. Its just a testament to the players in my opinion.

They fill library's full of information I don't know. I just come here to these forums to keep learning...trying to be a better coach for my players.

wjdempkowski said:

How much impact am I making?
I see my players for 3 hours a day, 6 days a week. So, let's look at the influence math. 24 days a month x 3 hours x 3 months equals 216 hours. Now, lets take an average travel ball team that practices 1 time a week for 52 weeks which equals 156 hours. Fundamental learning takes place in practice, not in games, therefore, HS coaches have more contact time with the athlete, thus a greater influence.

HS ball is unique, in that, HS coaches have a limited pool of participants. We are only allowed to select from athletes who attend our schools. With that, we may get, on average, 6 so-called travel/select players per team. The rest either come from Rec or have never played till HS.

In my travels, I continue to get athletes with poor throwing mechanics, outfielders who drift to the ball, batters who cast, batters who pull out early because they feel they need to "jack the ball", batters who's extension is toward third, rather than the pitcher, infielders who field the ball back between their feet, infielders who miss throws left and right because of cross body throwing, batters who watch first pitch strikes, bunters who can't see the bat and the ball or who can't place a bunt left or right, slappers who run away from the ball, pitchers who zero leg drive...the list goes on. For all the expert travel ball coaches who are making this tremendous impact, why do I see these things from my select players?

Just like there are some good and bad HS coaches, so too are there good and bad travel coaches. Let's not forget "Daddy Ball" coaches, parent in the stands coaches, teams that started because of conflict with an organization coaches, parents with blinders on coaches, etc... Now the Travel ball landscape is so watered down, that it seems even harder to find quality coaching happening.

How about this scenario, Coach of B level team goes to a C level tournament and whoops up on the competition. Now this coach is labeled a good coach and he/she is teaching these girls the right stuff. Go to a practice and observe, and this coach has a bat in one hand and a glove in the other. For hitting practice, front toss with one girl hitting while the rest shag. This coach is winning, so they must be good.

Sorry for the rant...I felt the need to defend HS coaches. It is a thankless job and I haven't met any HS coaches who weren't trying to help these student-athletes. They might not be the best, but they are giving of their time and energy. The same is true for their volunteer travel coaches.

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Rant appreciated. However, don't drive yourself crazy trying to do so. I deleted over 2,000 posts and maybe 50 threads from this site after getting into one of these arguments. Instead of ranting and raving now, I just use, "Never mind." In the end, and I know you know this, the players know. Today, my players will get in 300+ swings. The HC and I made the practice plan last night and the first thing this morning. She is great at that stuff and allowing me to do what I do. In doing so, we will run players from the cages in small groups to face pitchers who are going to finish up their bullpens throwing to live hitters. This will be live at bats with counts and both hitter and pitcher are trying to "win" each at bat. Yesterday and for a couple of days, I've worked hard at identifying hitter flaws. If you asked 22 girls now in our program, they have at least a #1 and #2 identified "flaw" or identified improvement that they are to work on. We will begin filming next and so, our hitters will get that breakdown along with everything else. The HC called last night at 9 to talk about practice. We don't just show up.

Cannonball said:

Rant appreciated. However, don't drive yourself crazy trying to do so. I deleted over 2,000 posts and maybe 50 threads from this site after getting into one of these arguments. Instead of ranting and raving now, I just use, "Never mind." In the end, and I know you know this, the players know.

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It's hard to have a conversation, a back and forth of ideas and concepts when you are dismissing the other side outright.

I think it's a interesting conversation about ROI of your practice time and how all of the pieces (paid coaches, travel coaches, high school coaches, and parents) fit together. My secondary point was that in my state high school coaches have less of an influence (on hitting and pitching).

I recognize that it may be different where you are located.

Gunner, I haven't "dismissed" anything or anyone. I simply state what I know to be true, what I do ... There are members here who know me and can verify what I do. There are members here who's children play against the team I coach. There are members here who know exactly what I do apart from coaching for those I teach and coach. I have never kept my identity a secret. Again, there comes a point where I just don't care to argue anymore. Heck, I don't have to be right. This is a message board. I do have to be right tonight when I coach my players to the best of my ability.