Request for Advice

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May 22, 2018
4
0
I've watched the discussions for some time, and decided to jump in with a request for advice.

DD is on a competitive team that generally performs well on the field. Among the players, she would fall middle-of-the-pack with her season performance at the plate currently being better than the team average.

Overall, playing time isn't the issue, but where she keeps showing up in the lineup is becoming one. Her coach likes putting a better batter at the bottom of the lineup, and this year, she's elected. Being the bottom of a 9 or even 10-batter lineup in a bracket game is a bit irritating, but she accepts her role there. However, she's also often down there in pool games when up to 12 batters are in the "everyone bats" lineup. This results in her getting one AB per game when most everyone hitting above her, some who she significantly outperforms, are getting two. It doesn't sound like much for one game, but it adds up over the course of a tournament.

This is a kid who, on previous teams, batted anywhere from lead-off to fifth, and frustration on both our parts is building. I've repeatedly told her that where you show up in the lineup isn't as important as what you do with it, but this is wearing on her confidence and ability to find some rhythm at the plate.

I'd like to address this in a non-confrontational way with the coach. It's obvious that he likes her personally, and just this last weekend was complimentary of her play this season, so I don't think there's anything malicious. I'm debating between talking to him myself or letting DD do it. I'm interested in the thoughts of the parents and coaches of older players on how to handle this. Thanks much!
 
Last edited:
Apr 24, 2017
203
28
Georgia
DD should talk to him about what she can do to move up in the batting order. She doesn't need to point out her performance, especially compared to others, as the coach is aware of what the numbers are. Just tell him she loves helping her team battle in games, she strives to always be productive at the plate, and she would like the opportunity to move up in the line up so she gets more reps. A good coach will tell her why she is there, and understand by this conversation that she would like to move around some when possible. She may still be at the bottom in bracket games but hopefully he can get her higher up for more reps in pool games. Good luck!

One small note- I am assuming she is 12u or older. Under that age, it can be harder for a DD to talk to coach about these issues. If she is younger, then I would suggest you talk to him with the same thoughts.
 
May 24, 2013
12,461
113
So Cal
Tacco - Welcome to DFP! :)

Gamommax3 pretty much nailed it. That said, I will add that one of the best ways to get your preferred spot - on either side of the ball - is to earn it with performance. You don't earn it by being as good as the player who has that spot now. You have to be better. Undeniably better. Be so good you can't be ignored. If your skills aren't undeniably better now, get to work until they are.

As a coach, I look at the last spot in the lineup as a pretty important role in setting a batting order. Ideally, I want a player who is similar to my 1 and 2 hitters - good OBP and some speed.
 
May 22, 2018
4
0
Tacco - Welcome to DFP! :)

Gamommax3 pretty much nailed it. That said, I will add that one of the best ways to get your preferred spot - on either side of the ball - is to earn it with performance. You don't earn it by being as good as the player who has that spot now. You have to be better. Undeniably better. Be so good you can't be ignored. If your skills aren't undeniably better now, get to work until they are.

As a coach, I look at the last spot in the lineup as a pretty important role in setting a batting order. Ideally, I want a player who is similar to my 1 and 2 hitters - good OBP and some speed.

I agree with both of you, and I understand the role of that last batter. She's ok with that role when the lineup is shorter and we're theoretically trying to win games. She doesn't even have a "preferred spot"...she just wants to get off the bottom occasionally. As I mentioned, she is obviously and significantly more effective than some of the players hitting ahead of her. Invariably, we can't get through a pool-play lineup twice because of time constraints plus the fact that there are a couple who can barely find their way to the batter's box.
 
Last edited:
May 24, 2013
12,461
113
So Cal
I agree with both of you, and I understand the role of that last batter. She's ok with that role when the lineup is shorter and we're theoretically trying to win games. She doesn't even have a "preferred spot"...she just wants to get off the bottom occasionally. As I mentioned, she is obviously and significantly more effective than some of the players hitting ahead of her. Invariably, we can't get through a pool-play lineup twice because of time constraints plus the fact that there are a couple who can barely find their way to the batter's box.

I understand where your frustration is. It sounds like a conversation with to coach is a good idea (both of you, or just her, depending on age).

FWIW, I consider the last spot in the lineup about 6th most important. Unless she's obviously better than one of the top 5 batters (which it doesn't sound like from your first post), and she's been effective as a setup hitter for the top of the lineup, I'm probably going to leaver her in that last spot for important games. For friendlies, I would be inclined to try her in a different spot.
 
Mar 1, 2016
195
18
Been there. What helped us is DD going to the coach to ask what the lineup philosophy is. Not to question it, but to understand it better. Some coaches use the 9 hole as a setup for the top of the order, while others only really focus on the top 5 and then roll the dice on the bottom 4 because they never thought about it that much. She got more playing time once by asking her coach to spend more time with her after practice to work on hitting. I’ve even seen coaches arrange a batting order by arranging short and tall players in alternating order in some convoluted attempt to mess with the pitcher on the strike zone. It takes all kinds of kinds.

If your DD expresses an interest in learning about the coach’s intent when he builds the lineup, it may open up a dialogue that gets her moved up. Or she may stay right where she is and be okay with it because she would understand why she is where she is. Or she might get mad enough to work extra. You never know until she talks to her coach. The most important thing is that she doesn’t come off as a complainer but makes it clear that she wants to learn why so she can better fill the role he intends for her.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
May 6, 2015
2,397
113
this is where DD2 is right now, has batted last in every game this season, pool and bracket (this team only does tourneys), looking at numbers she is middle third in just about any positive number you want to look at. she doesnt seem to mind, but I see her now with 25% fewer PAs than 90% of the team. harder to show what you can do when you have less opportunities, think I am gonna talk to coach at practice this week, we have our first real away tourney (requiring hotel) this weekend. even the one game coach messed around with rest of lineup, she was still last (doesnt matter how many we bat, she is last, and we almost always bat entire team every game).
 

JLF

Sep 18, 2017
46
6
As a coach, I look at the last spot in the lineup as a pretty important role in setting a batting order. Ideally, I want a player who is similar to my 1 and 2 hitters - good OBP and some speed.

I understand this strategy but it makes NO SENSE if a more productive batter only gets one AB per game. Coach has to adjust to the reality of his team.
 
May 24, 2013
12,461
113
So Cal
I understand this strategy but it makes NO SENSE if a more productive batter only gets one AB per game. Coach has to adjust to the reality of his team.

More productive than who? OP says she's middle-of-the-pack, slightly better than average on her team. Having a runner on base with the top of the lineup (the team's best hitters) coming up is a recipe for run production opportunities. A runner who gets on base a lot, but doesn't have good hitters behind her is often a lost opportunity. For me, a slow runner with power isn't the type of hitter I want in the last spot, neither is one of the bottom 1/3 hitters. Generally speaking, of my players that are fast/OBP type, the top 2 will probably be in the 1 and 2 spot. The 3rd best of that group will probably be in the last spot. You're absolutely right that without knowing the makeup of the whole team, we can only make guesses. Every hitter has strengths and weaknesses, and making that puzzle most productive is the magic trick.
 

JLF

Sep 18, 2017
46
6
OP said his DD was better than average and significantly better than some. I guess we read it differently.

her season performance at the plate currently being better than the team average.

This results in her getting one AB per game when most everyone hitting above her, some who she significantly outperforms, are getting two.

You are right, each team is a unique puzzle and I was guessing about her team.

Since they can't get through the whole lineup twice a game, I guessed they are a poor hitting team in general (and perhaps struggle to get off the field on defense). In that case, I think it would be wise to try to manufacture runs at the the top of the order to build momentum, gain confidence and put pressure on the other team/pitcher.

I have no problem with the strategy in general, and I agree with how you explained it, but IMO it isn't always the best strategy.
 

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