HS team attendance and planned events/appointments

I want to clarify something, because sometimes people from my DDs' HS read this forum, and I don't want to start rumors about the kid with the grandparents.

First off, the kid's grandfather died, but in the off-season. His grandmother was recently diagnosed with cancer, but is still alive.
I gave a hypothetical situation where what would a coach do if one of his grandparents died or became very ill during the season.

Also, this kid was out of town during spring break, but that was a vacation, and he sat out a few games as punishment. That had nothing to do with his grandparents.

I only say that because this kid and his brother have a LOT of friends on the softball team, so if a parent looks at this and thinks, oh wow, poor kid had his grandfather die and was benched, that is not the case. I just brought that up as a what would you do situation. in fact, I did talk to this kid right before a softball game about his situation, to try to give him some encouragement, and I had some questions afterwards about what was I talking to him about.

The other situation I mentioned, where my mother was punished by her HS Latin teacher for going to see her father off to battle in WW II actually happened, and she is STILL REALLY PISSED.

So, if you are unreasonable, remember some former student will still be cursing your name 72 years from now.

BobInMadison said:

I want to clarify something, because sometimes people from my DDs' HS read this forum, and I don't want to start rumors about the kid with the grandparents.

First off, the kid's grandfather died, but in the off-season. His grandmother was recently diagnosed with cancer, but is still alive.
I gave a hypothetical situation where what would a coach do if one of his grandparents died or became very ill during the season.

Also, this kid was out of town during spring break, but that was a vacation, and he sat out a few games as punishment. That had nothing to do with his grandparents.

I only say that because this kid and his brother have a LOT of friends on the softball team, so if a parent looks at this and thinks, oh wow, poor kid had his grandfather die and was benched, that is not the case. I just brought that up as a what would you do situation. in fact, I did talk to this kid right before a softball game about his situation, to try to give him some encouragement, and I had some questions afterwards about what was I talking to him about.

The other situation I mentioned, where my mother was punished by her HS Latin teacher for going to see her father off to battle in WW II actually happened, and she is STILL REALLY PISSED.

So, if you are unreasonable, remember some former student will still be cursing your name 72 years from now.

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I'm just throwing out hypotheticals as well just... the point being some coaches feel like if kid was in a car accident on the way to practice then shows up next day for the game after calling coach and explaining then coach greets her with Hey Susie you are not starting you are on the bench today...oh by the way glad you are OK that you should get a pat on the back because your being consistent and fair...others disagree and that's OK we can just agree to disagree.

djcarter1966 said:

I'm just throwing out hypotheticals as well just... the point being some coaches feel like if kid was in a car accident on the way to practice then shows up next day for the game after calling coach and explaining then coach greets her with Hey Susie you are not starting you are on the bench today...oh by the way glad you are OK that you should get a pat on the back because your being consistent and fair...others disagree and that's OK we can just agree to disagree.

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Got it........

Listen...bottom line is this. The player talks to the coach...The coach makes a decision on an individual basis. Coach's decision is final.

I personally never schedule doctor appointments (unless an extreme emergency) and vacations during the season. I just don't. Or I expect consequences from our coach- which I would understand. Prom is a different matter I believe. But also one I would let her skip softball to do things for prom & then be benched if that's what the coach wants.


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Whatever the policy, if the coach (or school) has a written policy that is agreed to by the parents/players, then there's really no room for complaints when the rules violation occurs. If you have an upcoming special situation, bring it up right away. A coach should absolutely have exceptions carved out for academics, injury, illness, emergencies, deaths in the family (I love pets, but "my dog died" is a terrible excuse), etc. But I really don't understand what parents think they're teaching their kids when they go out of their way to find ways to help (and sometimes force) their kids violate the commitment they made.

A lot of "consider this from the perspective of the parent" in here, so how's this: I'm not a parent, but I have parents. And my parents, because they were good parents, taught me responsibility and commitment, and when you agree to play for a team you're making a commitment to that team for the duration of that season. This is especially true when the expectation of prioritizing the team was made clear before you ever joined. If these other things are more important to you (or to your child), that's fine! But then accept whatever punishment comes from violating team rules or don't join the team. It's not that hard.

A lot of what I've seen is parents who are really just lazy and wouldn't understand commitment if it slapped them in the face. They don't want to bring their daughter back to the school after the appointment for no reason other than they're selfish and they're willing to sacrifice their child's success. Had a girl miss yesterday's game completely even though I know for a fact she could've met us at the field, especially since the game started about 45 minutes late. If she had shown up, she may not have played yesterday because she missed our pregame practice, but because she didn't show up at all, she now won't play Monday. Is that her fault? Partially. She knows the policy, and she could've made a stronger effort to show up. But it's mostly her mother's fault for setting up the appointment, for not mentioning it until the day before, for not keeping in touch with me to see if maybe she could bring her late, etc.

So to answer specifically: Doctor's appointments are not excused, except in certain circumstances (emergency illness, appointment for a specific injury, etc.). I would consider an exception if, when parents got a schedule in February, they said "Hey, on April 25th there's an appointment and it took months to get it and I just don't think I can change it." Because at least that shows an effort. When I'm told 15 minutes before practice? Nah. If the team isn't important enough to you to communicate, you can miss some playing time ("missing playing time" is, imo, the best way to handle these situations; forcing players to run or practice more or do anything like that is dumb).

Spring break: The softball season is 2 1/2 months. Weather can be so bad in the spring that softball season is really a 5 weeks, it seems. You *know* softball season and spring break are at the same time. So figure out what's important to you and deal with the consequences.

And a good coach/AD isn't going to schedule any games that interfere with major school events like Prom.

Havnt been able to repond since the original post day but I would like to thank everyone for the Civil discussion. As I re read the entire post I saw many points from many views, some I totally agree with, some not so much and some I don't agree with but the basis is sound. So if I were suddenly put in a HS HC postion here is how I would handle the 3 with some explanation.
1. Like most on here I have a job and most of us have some kind of attendance policy. I hope none have a zero tolerance policy. So first of yr before tryouts parent player meeting. "I have a policy of 1 unexcused absence that has no penalty. Please let me know as soon as you know you will miss. Our season starts x and runs thru y. Practice is from a to b time if there is a need to adjust I will let you know as soon as possiable. Some of you may have scheded follow ups with doctors several months ago. If possiable please move those to out of season. If that isn't possiable let me know those dates within the first week if you make the team. Please come to practice when finished if possible. I will allow up to 2 of those without penalty. Example orthodontist, surgery or injury follow ups, female related Dr etc. An emergency will be handled case by case after the others are used. Anything outside or beyond these will result in a game missed penelity. Anything inside of these has no penalty but remember I need to put someone in your place during your absence and if they make the most of the opportunity they can earn that spot in front of you". I see this as similar to life since jobs and schools have some type of attendance policy that isn't zero tolerance but does have penalty if excedded.
2. "We have games or tourny scheduled for spring break week. I expect everyone here. If there is something going on during that time to require absence please contact me for discussion ". Reasoning for me is this gives some flexibility for things I don't want to interfere with or is out of players control. Example, player and extended family from large distance have a tradition and been gathering since the child was young during that time. I would hate to force a child to miss it and grandma or other family member pass away and I caused them a chance to visit them. No do over on that one. Second example is parent wins a company paid trip somewhere and that family (parent) being forced to decide which is the least of 2 evils. Pass and rest of family miss out or go and player be penelized for parents luck. Tough one here as a free trip to local amusement park IMO doesn't qualify but all expense including air fare to somewhere that they could never afford otherwise does.
3. Prom or other school wide social event is scheduled around most of the time anyway in preseason. In the case of make ups I would refuse to schedule during that time.
Add on's: any class function that results in a grade or test is excused. Would try to work with teacher but grades are first.

Now I promise I would probably have to adjust or modify this over time as experiences would dictate, but would be a fair starting point. Me and DW have done our best through the yrs to accommodate coaches and their season. I have seen two instance of a coach being a total jerk in my opinion. There were times I didn't agree but theIR team their rules, abide or don't play.

Havnt been able to repond since the original post day but I would like to thank everyone for the Civil discussion. As I re read the entire post I saw many points from many views, some I totally agree with, some not so much and some I don't agree with but the basis is sound. So if I were suddenly put in a HS HC postion here is how I would handle the 3 with some explanation.
1. Like most on here I have a job and most of us have some kind of attendance policy. I hope none have a zero tolerance policy. So first of yr before tryouts parent player meeting. "I have a policy of 1 unexcused absence that has no penalty. Please let me know as soon as you know you will miss. Our season starts x and runs thru y. Practice is from a to b time if there is a need to adjust I will let you know as soon as possiable. Some of you may have scheded follow ups with doctors several months ago. If possiable please move those to out of season. If that isn't possiable let me know those dates within the first week if you make the team. Please come to practice when finished if possible. I will allow up to 2 of those without penalty. Example orthodontist, surgery or injury follow ups, female related Dr etc. An emergency will be handled case by case after the others are used. Anything outside or beyond these will result in a game missed penelity. Anything inside of these has no penalty but remember I need to put someone in your place during your absence and if they make the most of the opportunity they can earn that spot in front of you". I see this as similar to life since jobs and schools have some type of attendance policy that isn't zero tolerance but does have penalty if excedded.
2. "We have games or tourny scheduled for spring break week. I expect everyone here. If there is something going on during that time to require absence please contact me for discussion ". Reasoning for me is this gives some flexibility for things I don't want to interfere with or is out of players control. Example, player and extended family from large distance have a tradition and been gathering since the child was young during that time. I would hate to force a child to miss it and grandma or other family member pass away and I caused them a chance to visit them. No do over on that one. Second example is parent wins a company paid trip somewhere and that family (parent) being forced to decide which is the least of 2 evils. Pass and rest of family miss out or go and player be penelized for parents luck. Tough one here as a free trip to local amusement park IMO doesn't qualify but all expense including air fare to somewhere that they could never afford otherwise does.
3. Prom or other school wide social event is scheduled around most of the time anyway in preseason. In the case of make ups I would refuse to schedule during that time.
Add on's: any class function that results in a grade or test is excused. Would try to work with teacher but grades are first.

Now I promise I would probably have to adjust or modify this over time as experiences would dictate, but would be a fair starting point. Me and DW have done our best through the yrs to accommodate coaches and their season. I have seen two instance of a coach being a total jerk in my opinion. There were times I didn't agree but theIR team their rules, abide or don't play.

CoachJD said:

Whatever the policy, if the coach (or school) has a written policy that is agreed to by the parents/players, then there's really no room for complaints when the rules violation occurs. If you have an upcoming special situation, bring it up right away. A coach should absolutely have exceptions carved out for academics, injury, illness, emergencies, deaths in the family (I love pets, but "my dog died" is a terrible excuse), etc. But I really don't understand what parents think they're teaching their kids when they go out of their way to find ways to help (and sometimes force) their kids violate the commitment they made.

A lot of "consider this from the perspective of the parent" in here, so how's this: I'm not a parent, but I have parents. And my parents, because they were good parents, taught me responsibility and commitment, and when you agree to play for a team you're making a commitment to that team for the duration of that season. This is especially true when the expectation of prioritizing the team was made clear before you ever joined. If these other things are more important to you (or to your child), that's fine! But then accept whatever punishment comes from violating team rules or don't join the team. It's not that hard.

A lot of what I've seen is parents who are really just lazy and wouldn't understand commitment if it slapped them in the face. They don't want to bring their daughter back to the school after the appointment for no reason other than they're selfish and they're willing to sacrifice their child's success. Had a girl miss yesterday's game completely even though I know for a fact she could've met us at the field, especially since the game started about 45 minutes late. If she had shown up, she may not have played yesterday because she missed our pregame practice, but because she didn't show up at all, she now won't play Monday. Is that her fault? Partially. She knows the policy, and she could've made a stronger effort to show up. But it's mostly her mother's fault for setting up the appointment, for not mentioning it until the day before, for not keeping in touch with me to see if maybe she could bring her late, etc.

So to answer specifically: Doctor's appointments are not excused, except in certain circumstances (emergency illness, appointment for a specific injury, etc.). I would consider an exception if, when parents got a schedule in February, they said "Hey, on April 25th there's an appointment and it took months to get it and I just don't think I can change it." Because at least that shows an effort. When I'm told 15 minutes before practice? Nah. If the team isn't important enough to you to communicate, you can miss some playing time ("missing playing time" is, imo, the best way to handle these situations; forcing players to run or practice more or do anything like that is dumb).

Spring break: The softball season is 2 1/2 months. Weather can be so bad in the spring that softball season is really a 5 weeks, it seems. You *know* softball season and spring break are at the same time. So figure out what's important to you and deal with the consequences.

And a good coach/AD isn't going to schedule any games that interfere with major school events like Prom.

Click to expand...

Maybe I should have gone into more detail than “the dog died” so you wouldn’t say it’s a terrible excuse and question my parenting skills. IF you were a parent you’d understand there’s a huge difference between losing a pet and watching your kids lose the pet they grew up with. You do whatever you can to help them with the grieving process. That doesn’t mean we’re lazy or forcing them to break their commitments. The dog was terminally ill. DD is away at college so wife drive the dog down and let both kids be there as she was put to sleep. Lots of tears, but they got through it. Both kids approached their coaches beforehand and were still able to play. Son’s team has the rule, For DD it’s just a given that they’ll be there. Neither had an issue sitting if that was the consequence. They take their commitments and their sports seriously, but it was more important for them to be there to comfort their dog in her final moments. I don’t regret letting, or forcing them to break their commitment. It’s a three hour drive home, so no way son would be back for practice. DD went, but coaches sent her home.

I've had a few dogs in my day.

My parents never made a big deal about putting a dog down. That was just the way they were. OTOH, my former next door neighbors made a HUGE deal of it when their dog died. They have a house out in the country, a few hours north of here, and they drove out there with their son to bury their dog (but not their son).

The grieving process is so different for everyone. I loved my dogs more than you can imagine, but for me, grieving wasn't that big a deal. For other people it is.

A family dog is part of the family, and grieving is a natural process. There is no right or wrong way to do it. There is a right way that works for your family.

Sorry to hear of your dog.