This why many Florida JUCO's play SEC teams in the Fall.
A different high school thread...
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Our HS coach was the opposite. She scheduled the minimum number of games and never against any larger schools if we didn't have to play them. FF to this year and we have a new coach who has our sub 400 student school playing 2500 student schools. It makes the teams better and improves the RPI when seeding for states.
I'm always fascinated by HS programs that continually put out successful teams year after year.
I mean. . . you get what you get. . . you either have a pitcher (or quarterback, or point guard or whatever) or you don't. A power hitter (or a few) or you don't.
You can't have "mediocre" talent overcome stronger talent. . .can you?
I mean. . . you get what you get. . . you either have a pitcher (or quarterback, or point guard or whatever) or you don't. A power hitter (or a few) or you don't.
You can't have "mediocre" talent overcome stronger talent. . .can you?
Most really good HS programs that I have seen have good youth programs and plenty of girls who play travel ball.
Then you have the schools that have a run of good years when they have a stud pitcher and then they go back to being average after their pitcher graduates. A string of sisters who pitch can set up a high school for quite a few years.
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Cannonball
Ex "Expert"
- Feb 25, 2009
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The school I coach as is not considered a softball power but we do ok. However, we are considered a soccer school and our girl's soccer team is always one of the top teams in our area and this part of the state. They have won a couple of state championships and consistently put players in college. So, we don't draw from many girls when you consider most of our girls play soccer. In fact, over half of our middle school softball team is on the soccer team. What we have to do then is get one, two or three very good players each year and we seem to always have to rely on freshmen. This year is no different. We have young ladies in the 7th and 8th grade hitting with me now so that they will be ready to move in and battle for starting spots. We had 22 girls tryout this year.
You can have a major effect on what you get and how the talent that might be available to you is developed:
Take for example the teams in our county:
1) The 3 private school campuses who care about sports do recruit and they are always in with a real chance of winning state championships year after year. In the last 4 years they have 7 or 8 state championships between the 3 schools and several runners up results when they didn't win it. One of these also has a premier national level travel association associated with the school, so they recruit here as well. (i.e. chance to get scholarships/money to attend private school if you also play travel for org X). The other is the 'big' football school locally but is also the preferred Catholic high school that all the K-8 Catholic schools feed into. I would argue that none of these schools have ever helped develop a player ever - not even with their travel program - but they have something to offer all the available talent which is very attractive. I often joke that I have got many players 'money for school' - even if it is for high school.
2) There are 2 REALLY attractive charter schools that EVERYONE wants to get their kids into if you live in their zoned area. These are the shining jewels in how a charter school SHOULD be run. Both are expanding with additional HS capacity and also additional middle school campuses. There is a long waiting list to get in, and there is a lottery to get into either school. For some suspicious reason, the lottery keeps landing them great athletes. Apparently great pitchers and power hitters are really lucky when it comes to charter school lotteries. Couple of magnet schools have done similar things, but not with the success these 2 charter schools have achieved. One is going for a three-peat - the other has not been able to get past a similar type school from the northern part of the state but have not finished worse than 5th in 8+ years..
3) You can hope the local travel or rec programs are good and supply players... or if you are a coach planning on being around awhile you can do something about it. The VERY first thing my DD did in softball as a 6 year old was participate in the yearly rec clinic run by our local HS coach and his players (now my DD is one of the girls helping to run it). Coach is active in helping the local rec league, has a fantastic summer softball camp for 8-13 years olds, invites their players out to games, etc, etc. He turns up at showcases and local tournaments to watch girls zoned for the school. And so on. My DD has been looking forward to playing HS softball here since she was 8 years old. Now he has been coaching the HS program for 12+ years so he has longevity on his side. But you don't need it (see Cannonball working with potential players in 7th and 8th grade). There are 3-4 other local high schools who work closely with their local programs - it is no coincidence these high schools consistently perform well year after year.
No matter how they got they get their players, it is never a surprise that these HS teams perform locally year after year with few down years. it is no surprise that over the years thee schools have developed the better high school facilities for softball - you get back what you put into the program. It is the good side of HS softball. Alumni players and parents often come out for games - and games between any of the schools above always have a sizeable crowd. All these teams travel well.
Sure, occasionally another school lucks into a great pitcher or several good players all at once, but it is always temporary and they never seem to have the depth to compete consistently with the teams above. Note: 9 times out of 10 you can recognize this situation as the dad of the pitcher is normally the head coach or on the coaching staff while his kid is there
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Our districts are our smallest group of teams. AAA is TN largest softball classification. In AAA, we have 16 districts that make up 8 regions, that make up 4 sectionals (sub-state) and this is how the state tournament plays out. The top two teams keep advancing from district, region and sectionals to the state tourney. Which gives us an eight team state tournament.
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The involvement of the coach in the younger ages is to me one of the biggest things that helps a program. The town over the coach and staff are very involved and have had goods teams at all ages through HS for years. (had a 12u team play up to 14u and still killing teams).
Our coach does not. When asked to help with town travel team and do skill clinics with younger kids said she had no interest.
Yet her job is only safe because she happened to have two D1 recruits the last two years and a stud pitch who will graduating this year to take them deep. Yet feel short at state because she road the pitcher so hard that her arm had nothing left at the state tourny.
Before those players barely a .500 team.
Our coach does not. When asked to help with town travel team and do skill clinics with younger kids said she had no interest.
Yet her job is only safe because she happened to have two D1 recruits the last two years and a stud pitch who will graduating this year to take them deep. Yet feel short at state because she road the pitcher so hard that her arm had nothing left at the state tourny.
Before those players barely a .500 team.
Sorry to start a thread and then kinda abandon ship. I don't look at the computer all weekend at home. I sit in front of one 5 days a week.
First of all, Cannonball your post did not come across as arrogant at all. Nothing wrong with being proud of success and hard work. I realize that there are only so many high schools in the area, and I believe that they put extra games on the schedule, knowing that some will be rained out. We are up to 8 rain outs including todays game. I just believe that it would make more sense to take some of those games off the schedule and play our actual conference opponents more than once. There are several programs that we play every year that we never beat. We played Cannonballs team twice this year. The first one was not a blow out, but I don't believe they had their best game. The second one was a blow out. I guess there is nothing wrong with playing better competition if the girls learn something. My problem is when our team is getting blown out our coaches give up also and stop coaching. They litterally just stand there and watch. We played a good team the other day and the girl was throwing rise balls. They were nowhere near the strike zone. But out coaches just stood there and watched girl after girl chase them and strike out. Said nothing. Nothing. If they would have laid off of the high rise, they were balls every time. I digress.
I guess high school is what it is. You take what comes up as a freshman every year. We had three or four freshman come out this year. Only one had ever played softball before. She is our starting SS. The other girls had not even played rec ball before. Next year there will only be a couple of girls coming up that have even played before. And I don't want to turn this into a coaching bash at all because I personally like our coaches. I just think that they just "take what they can get" and play with them. They don't try to TEACH anything. The girls either know how to play or they don't. Watching our JV games is just painfull. Some of the swings that are shown, obviously the girls have had zero instruction on how to hit, or even how to assume a good athletic stance. That is where a good hitting coach, like cannonball, does wonders for a program. Would have loved to have someone like that at our school. OK...Sorry, I have rambled long enough.
First of all, Cannonball your post did not come across as arrogant at all. Nothing wrong with being proud of success and hard work. I realize that there are only so many high schools in the area, and I believe that they put extra games on the schedule, knowing that some will be rained out. We are up to 8 rain outs including todays game. I just believe that it would make more sense to take some of those games off the schedule and play our actual conference opponents more than once. There are several programs that we play every year that we never beat. We played Cannonballs team twice this year. The first one was not a blow out, but I don't believe they had their best game. The second one was a blow out. I guess there is nothing wrong with playing better competition if the girls learn something. My problem is when our team is getting blown out our coaches give up also and stop coaching. They litterally just stand there and watch. We played a good team the other day and the girl was throwing rise balls. They were nowhere near the strike zone. But out coaches just stood there and watched girl after girl chase them and strike out. Said nothing. Nothing. If they would have laid off of the high rise, they were balls every time. I digress.
I guess high school is what it is. You take what comes up as a freshman every year. We had three or four freshman come out this year. Only one had ever played softball before. She is our starting SS. The other girls had not even played rec ball before. Next year there will only be a couple of girls coming up that have even played before. And I don't want to turn this into a coaching bash at all because I personally like our coaches. I just think that they just "take what they can get" and play with them. They don't try to TEACH anything. The girls either know how to play or they don't. Watching our JV games is just painfull. Some of the swings that are shown, obviously the girls have had zero instruction on how to hit, or even how to assume a good athletic stance. That is where a good hitting coach, like cannonball, does wonders for a program. Would have loved to have someone like that at our school. OK...Sorry, I have rambled long enough.
Our team is playing 20 games this season. Its crazy to me that some of you guys are getting in 30+ games. That's what I get with the Northeast weather.
Anyway, we play the schools in our county, plus some close neighboring counties. We are a small school. Our rec program is horrible, it goes through the school district and we play other schools, like HS. I was assisting the JH team, but left. I was told that the school and most parents in the district don't like travel players or coaches and that travel teams are bad for school sports. Still confused as to why, if they don't like travel coaches, they wanted me to help. Once I saw the lack of discipline and commitment in the entire program and the way the HC was backing parents for things they said about me coaching instead of backing me as a volunteer head coach, I left. I moved and had to leave being the HC/President for an organization that I think did pretty good and helped make some pretty good ball players.
It must be great to live in an area where travel players are looked at as a benefit to the team instead of something bad.
Anyway, we play the schools in our county, plus some close neighboring counties. We are a small school. Our rec program is horrible, it goes through the school district and we play other schools, like HS. I was assisting the JH team, but left. I was told that the school and most parents in the district don't like travel players or coaches and that travel teams are bad for school sports. Still confused as to why, if they don't like travel coaches, they wanted me to help. Once I saw the lack of discipline and commitment in the entire program and the way the HC was backing parents for things they said about me coaching instead of backing me as a volunteer head coach, I left. I moved and had to leave being the HC/President for an organization that I think did pretty good and helped make some pretty good ball players.
It must be great to live in an area where travel players are looked at as a benefit to the team instead of something bad.
