Rule question - no steal of Home

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May 24, 2013
12,461
113
So Cal
Reading about the limitations put on younger age groups, it makes me wonder if the limitations are helping or hindering player development.

In So Cal, ASA-affiliated leagues are including some level of player-pitch at 8U, and by the time all-stars starts up, it's all player pitch. 8U pitchers start learning how to control the ball, and 8U hitters start learning how to read pitches and make good choices on what to swing at. It's not uncommon for better 8U pitchers to be very effective with fastballs and change-ups. In contrast, I have read more than a few times about rec leagues that have machine-pitch in 12U...SMH.

While I agree that some limitations are probably reasonable for 8U, everything that I have seen tells me that 10U players are mentally and physically capable of playing with the full rules. Including the stress of dropped 3rd strikes, stolen bases, etc. demands that they perform, and (IMO) that's a good thing for skill development. Kids will do their very best to rise to those demands.
 
Jun 27, 2011
5,089
0
North Carolina
While I agree that some limitations are probably reasonable for 8U, everything that I have seen tells me that 10U players are mentally and physically capable of playing with the full rules. Including the stress of dropped 3rd strikes, stolen bases, etc. demands that they perform, and (IMO) that's a good thing for skill development. Kids will do their very best to rise to those demands.

If you make it too hard, you'll lose players. If you make it too easy, you'll lose players. So, stating the obvious, you have to find the right balance. I used to argue that it should go slowly, but I understand now that I was basing that on the experience of the one rec league that I ran. Now I believe the best pace/balance can be very different from place to place. If I'm in a hotbed of softball, where there's tradition and history, then you can speed it up. But softball is a difficult game, and if you're in a place where you're struggling to build participation, and you make it too hard, kids are going to do something easier, like soccer or basketball. :)
 
May 24, 2013
12,461
113
So Cal
If you make it too hard, you'll lose players. If you make it too easy, you'll lose players. So, stating the obvious, you have to find the right balance. I used to argue that it should go slowly, but I understand now that I was basing that on the experience of the one rec league that I ran. Now I believe the best pace/balance can be very different from place to place. If I'm in a hotbed of softball, where there's tradition and history, then you can speed it up. But softball is a difficult game, and if you're in a place where you're struggling to build participation, and you make it too hard, kids are going to do something easier, like soccer or basketball. :)

Valid points, CB. Quality of coaching would also be a pretty significant factor.
 
Nov 8, 2014
182
0
Kids struggle to throw strikes at 10U. We instilled coach pitch after four balls. IOW - no walks. It made the game a lot of fun and it kept kids coming back and not falling for lacrosse. Steal of home at 10U is key to teaching a kid to make an instant decision on their own and to get the battery used to covering that plate and protecting against the steal. Not allowing home steals destroys the game and is sure to make for a VERY long inning especially if its just a walk fest.
 
Nov 26, 2010
4,784
113
Michigan
In 10 u it encourages the kids to swing the bat. Otherwise coachs would want them to wait out the pitcher for a wild pitch to score on. And then you can swing. Teach the batters the importance of getting the ball in play to drive in runs
 

MTR

Jun 22, 2008
3,438
48
Reading about the limitations put on younger age groups, it makes me wonder if the limitations are helping or hindering player development.

In So Cal, ASA-affiliated leagues are including some level of player-pitch at 8U, and by the time all-stars starts up, it's all player pitch. 8U pitchers start learning how to control the ball, and 8U hitters start learning how to read pitches and make good choices on what to swing at. It's not uncommon for better 8U pitchers to be very effective with fastballs and change-ups. In contrast, I have read more than a few times about rec leagues that have machine-pitch in 12U...SMH.

While I agree that some limitations are probably reasonable for 8U, everything that I have seen tells me that 10U players are mentally and physically capable of playing with the full rules. Including the stress of dropped 3rd strikes, stolen bases, etc. demands that they perform, and (IMO) that's a good thing for skill development. Kids will do their very best to rise to those demands.

These "limitations" were not installed as limitations, but the original softball rules for everyone and were pared back over the years
 

Axe

Jul 7, 2011
459
18
Atlanta
When DD's played in the State tournament this past spring, they had to learn a few extra rules they don't normally play with. Our rec league has a run limit and a steal limit (only 1 base a time even if there's an overthrow). The stolen base rule changes in 12U however.

But at the state tournament, you could not steal home nor could you steal second on a walk (which is fine since we didn't do that often). However, in 10U, stealing home is pretty common. We played teams from other areas of the state, and they said they play by that rule too.

Is that common at all? Obviously in TB, a lot of these rec rules do not apply.
But why would you disallow stealing home?

These rules are exactly why so many Rec All-Stars teams in GA have avoided participating in the USSSA All-Star "State Tournament". Those rules are ridiculous and completely inconsistent with how any other All-Star tournaments are played in GA.
 
Jun 12, 2015
3,848
83
To me the combo kid/coach pitch and rules on stealing make sense for rec ball. I watched some 10U rec games last year, and they really are not advanced players at all. Our 8U travel team wasn't even very good and probably could have competed with even most of the 12U teams in the county rec program. I would be annoyed to play a travel tournament with those rules though. Our current 10U team is a weird mix of girls, some being brand new to travel ball, and they're doing fine keeping up with the rules. We have 2 main pitchers and both have no trouble throwing strikes. We have 2 backup pitchers who get an inning here and there who also can throw strikes pretty reliably. But in rec it's mostly rolling across the plate or flying over the umpire's head at 10U. I think most rec parents aren't investing in lessons and hours on the bucket.

I don't know what the All Stars rules are around here for 10U though, since we played 8U all stars then went to travel. It seems like All Stars should start to get the rec girls ready for travel since so many of them will move in that direction. AT the same time, if it's totally different rules from their rec programs they may struggle.
 
May 13, 2012
599
18
For rec legue play make the rules according to skill level and keep the game fun. Like others said this would vary from area to area. All stars need to be consistent since the team is composed of the best players from the league. TB I see no problem with it being set up different from area to area but if the rules are different TD's need to make it known early not at the coin toss. Our area is not a hot bed by no means. Several TD's do a good job of keeping thier tournys equal. Play this directors tourny going to be mostly B and Rec teams. Play that one's and mostly high B and A. They try to hold down the trophy hunters if they can. The rules are consistant tourny to tourny.
 
Jan 31, 2011
453
43
From my experience coaching both rec and TB, there is a valid reason for not allowing a run to score on a pass ball.. Like stated earlier, runs from pass balls at 10U are common except for "A" level teams. If a younger/less developed 10U team playing a more experienced 10U team, a closed home plate takes away the easy unearned runs and makes the teams earn those runs. These tourney rules also tend to attract the younger teams and discourage the "A" level teams from playing in them. I have been on both sides of that one. It stinks to get hammered on by an "A" level 10U team when your players are just starting out. No one learns much at all...

A good coach will attend a tourney with rules that are appropriate to the level of the team he/she is coaching. "Stealing home" to me means "delayed steal home" which is something I never taught because it doesn't happen (very uncommon) at the older ages. It's a waste of practice time to teach this to baserunners. As a catcher develops, that kid dancing around on the 3rd baseline is an easy out. The fact that younger (10U) catcher's (and pitcher's) can typically have weaker arms and reaction time relative to a fast/savvy baserunner's speed makes this play common at 10U, IMO. Now, delay steal 2nd or 3rd base is a very teachable tool.
 

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