Umpire Appeal on 2-Strike Foul Ball: Bunt or Swing for Lefty

Welcome to Discuss Fastpitch

Your FREE Account is waiting to the Best Softball Community on the Web.

12U Tournament championship, 3 umpires, ASA this weekend. Batter is LH. I am coaching the batter, so I know she is trying to slap (swing away) for the entire at bat. Batter takes multiple run-ups on attempted slaps, two swing-and-miss strikes. No indication from home plate umpire that he thought she was bunting; i.e. no verbal such as "she offered". Batter is still learning, has a downward swing, and her top hand tends to fly off the handle.

Batter fouls off the next pitch, home plate umpire calls "foul ball". Opposing coach yells out "Can I get an appeal on whether she bunted foul 3rd strike?" The 3rd base umpire agreed with the opposing coach saying "I saw her hands separate." Strike 3.

Ugh. I don't think hands separating is good criteria for differentiating between a bunt and a strike. From my research on this site, it doesn't sound like ASA has a good definition of a bunt vs. a swing to make any sort of appeal, however. Would the forum agree? I've seen coaches teach bunting with hands together as a LHB to hide the bunt. By this umpire's definition, you could do that with 2 strikes, foul it off and continue batting.

Wouldn't it be better to judge whether the bat is moving to hit the ball (swing) or the ball is moving to hit the bat (bunt)?

Thank you for your feedback.
 
Last edited:
Mar 26, 2013
1,934
0
Umpires usually point at the definition for bunt - "A pitched ball that is intentionally tapped with the bat, slowly, within the infield."
 
Jun 22, 2008
3,731
113
Hands separating has absolutely nothing to do with being a bunt. Either the batter was attempting to hit the ball (swinging) or they were bunting and the definition of a bunt was provided by SoCal.
 
Umpires usually point at the definition for bunt - "A pitched ball that is intentionally tapped with the bat, slowly, within the infield."

Sounds like about 50% of 8U contact to me. As a 2011 DFP thread pointed out, by definition no foul ball is a bunt, since foul territory isn't in the infield. :p

A weak swing isn't going to have a lot of follow through against a 40 mph (est.) fastball, so I can understand how the bat's momentum being stopped could lead an umpire to think that a bunt was attempted, but to use the hand separation as justification for the call is off to me.

I know an umpire can't assume the batter won't try to bunt with 2 strikes, but if it's a 50/50 coin flip on deciding swing vs. bunt, wouldn't likely intent tend to play a part in making a call? The rule uses the language "intentionally", so to me, that is what an umpire should take into account.
 
Jun 22, 2008
3,731
113
Stopping a swing at contact is also not an indication of it being a bunt or not, and as just stated above the feet also have no bearing on if it is a bunt or not. I have seen half swings put the ball over the fence, so that is also not a determining factor. On the other hand, I have also seen batters just stick the bat out and walk forward through the batters box and then had the coach argue it was a slap attempt.

It comes down to purely umpire judgement as to if the batter was trying to tap the ball slowly in the infield, or if they were trying to actually hit the ball.
 
Sep 25, 2014
7
1
Massachusetts
Not a coach, just a parent who happened to see this post and was so excited that people from all over the country might be talking about a game that my dd played in, I thought I'd ask to make sure. Thank you
 

Latest posts

Members online

No members online now.

Forum statistics

Threads
42,830
Messages
679,468
Members
21,443
Latest member
sstop28
Top