Screw the Screwball?

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Aug 21, 2008
2,379
113
I have never understood the fascination with the screwball, or the belief in it. Like a lot of pitches, I think a lot of parents (and pitchers and their coaches) look at where the pitch ends up, not any break. It's why the ESPN announcers make my ears bleed when Michele Smith talks about this pitcher's great rise, drop, curve, screw, etc. Yes, even at the D1 level, the majority of pitchers have horrible mechanics and the falsehood of their pitches is helped by the bad announcing.

Maybe I'm just too much of a simple minded guy, like Forrest Gump. If I want a dropball outside on a RH batter, I'm not going to get cute with a "crop" which is nothing but a load of "crap!" I'm going to throw the drop on the outside. If it doesn't do 1 of the 2 things it's supposed to in the "crop" then it hangs over the middle. And we wonder why HR totals are up? And if I'm going to throw inside, why screw around (pardon the pun) with a screwball? A drop inside is the deadliest pitch but it's not as 'sexy' as the rise. Why risk the ball not moving inside? If you throw a drop inside and it doesn't go down, at least it's still inside!!!!

I've been doing lessons for a very long time (or so it seems). I've had students who've never made it past rec ball to ones playing for Alabama, and every kind in between. EVERY one who claims to have had a screwball stepped left and threw right. About 1/2 had a different spin on the ball, the other half had no other spin than their "fastball" but it was thrown inside and they believed it screwed. None ever BROKE. I've lost many students because parents didn't bring their kid back after telling them they don't actually have 12 pitches. She has one, and one that has bullet spin that doesn't move. "But she strikes out 15 per game?" "she set her high school record for K's!" And that's where the conversations turn... high school softball is a lot of bad softball (yes there is some good ones too). And her 15 per game is rec ball, not ASA Gold. But parents get drunk on the belief that 15 k's at 11 years old will equal 18 K's when she gets older. The opposite is true in most cases.

But these 10 different pitch pitchers are usually Hello Elbow type, which prevents them from throwing almost any pitch with true rotation and form. Again, a lot of parents who's sunk $1000's into pitching coaches and camps don't want to hear that. But, I always offer them the YouTube challenge. Forget with this Olympic pitcher told you at her clinic, watch YouTube tonight and see if she is doing THAT or THIS. The majority who take the challenge will email or call to tell me "WOW". Others will say they are too far along in what they are doing and won't change now. Very sad, but true. Then I become the "arrogant" one who thinks only 'his way' works... despite my repeated saying that this is not "MY WAY".... I didn't invent anything.

Bill
 
May 30, 2013
1,442
83
Binghamton, NY
Throw that bulletspin pitch. After all it is much easier to be lucky than throw a good breaking pitch.

my comment wasnt so much to say that kids should aspire to throw a bullet spin,
but more that as slo mo content of high level pitchers becomes more and more accessible,
we are learning that many actually throw bullet spin rises, screws, etc.

again, nothing to aspire to, necessarily.
but makes one realize even moreso why the rare ones like Cat are so effective...
 

sluggers

Super Moderator
Staff member
May 26, 2008
7,128
113
Dallas, Texas
OK...We have two of the most respected pitching coaches in the country agreeing that the screwball in softball pitching doesn't exist.

Case closed. Another myth dead.
 
Jun 13, 2012
90
6
I had the unique chance to talk to Chelsea Thomas's (former Missouri and current USSSA Pride pitcher) father at the NPF Championship 2 weeks ago about his DD's journey for about a half hour. He said especially at the NPF level all the pitchers HAD to learn to throw up and down pitches.. The batters at the NPF level will kill a curve/screw ball.. Really made me think about Ricketts struggles in the last couple of years. Her go to pitch was her crop in college and she was extremely effective in college but as he said, in the NPF THE BATTERS ARE TOUGH 1-9.
 
Feb 17, 2014
7,152
113
Orlando, FL
OK...We have two of the most respected pitching coaches in the country agreeing that the screwball in softball pitching doesn't exist.

Case closed. Another myth dead.

Neither Pauly nor Hillhouse made that statement so who are the pitching coaches? Since Rick Pauly teaches it there is no way he is one of them. Unless you are claiming he is teaching a pitch that cannot be thrown?
 
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sluggers

Super Moderator
Staff member
May 26, 2008
7,128
113
Dallas, Texas
Rick Pauly:

The number of screwball pitchers I've seen who truly get any measurable inward ball movement is probably less than 3 in all my years.

Bill Hillhouse:
EVERY one who claims to have had a screwball stepped left and threw right. About 1/2 had a different spin on the ball, the other half had no other spin than their "fastball" but it was thrown inside and they believed it screwed. None ever BROKE.

Meriam-Webster defines "screwball" as, "A pitch that is thrown with spin so that the ball curves in a direction that is opposite to the direction of a curveball."

Therefore, the pitch that is taught (step left, throw right) is *NOT* a screwball, as defined by the dictionary, because it doesn't curve.

Of course, you could say, "Screball means whatever we want it to mean," in which case the discussion turns into a philosophical discussion about newspeak, logical positivism, and linguisitcs...but, that seems a little heady for a softball forum.

For clarity, I'm not saying that the pitch shouldn't be taught or isn't effective. But, it certainly is not a movement pitch.

If a kid wants to learn the pitch, the focus should be on the proper mechanics for the pitch as outline by Rick rather than spending hours trying to master "screwball spin".

Ken B: Show me a video of a softball pitcher throwing a pitch with "baseball" screwball spin.
 
Last edited:
Feb 17, 2014
7,152
113
Orlando, FL
Rick Pauly:



Bill Hillhouse:


Meriam-Webster defines "screwball" as, "A pitch that is thrown with spin so that the ball curves in a direction that is opposite to the direction of a curveball."

Therefore, the pitch that is taught (step left, throw right) is *NOT* a screwball, as defined by the dictionary, because it doesn't curve.

For clarity, I'm not saying that the pitch shouldn't be taught or isn't effective. It is. But, it certainly is not a movement pitch.

So we now have a pitch the does not exist, does not move, but is effective and should be taught. Got it!
 
Feb 3, 2010
5,768
113
Pac NW
Ken B: Show me a video of a softball pitcher throwing a pitch with "baseball" screwball spin.

Sorry--Failed to add a winky smilie. Like many, I'd love to see that video too.

I have seen one pitcher (JV high schooler) who throws a scrop. Her motion is almost side arm and its her only pitch. I doubt she'll ever make varsity.
 

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