Arm Position when stride foot lands...

dmaeganx2 said:

I have a question then I referenced this to my DD and she is at 8:00 when her heel touches down , her toe touches down at about 10:00 I believe that would mean she needs to shorten stride ???

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This is a typical result of having the arms leading the initial forward momentum. The chest/body needs to initiate the drive as the arms are loading. (ball go back while the body comes forward) this will sync up the timing to toe touch at 12 and heel plant at 10

Light bulb moment!. Chest body initiates the forward move. I was struggling on how to explain this. That should do it for us.

D,

On my mobile right now... so I can't review video... which is what you should be doing instead of stills. It sounds like her timing is off. Review the Pushback video I posted in the DM thread. Knight touches on this in his posts regarding weightless moves. Watch the parts regarding the first two points of overlap... and see if she is reaching them in order. If the touchdown is off, it goes all the way back to the first point of overlap (body moving forward as backswing moves rearward) - like coach mentions. Then see if her stride foot is descending once her arm gets past three. If these two points are on, you need not worry about the third.... just happens.

Regarding stride foot touch down and arm position. There is no valid "check point" regarding the arm position at "toe-touch" or "heel-plant"..........

Toe touch DOES NOT MATTER, because it adds nothing to the whip. Heel plant DOES NOT MATTER because it adds nothing to the whip. The ONLY valid check point that exists, or even matters between stride foot touch down and arm position, occurs when ground reaction force (GRF) enters the physics of the whip equation.

Arm speed, the width or circumference of a particular pitchers arm circle, stride length and the like, must all coincide with GRF as the arm is at, or almost at the last quarter circle, or parallel to the ground (9:00)..........Thats ALL that matters with regard to energy transfer.........And everything discussed on the timing of the circle culminates at this check point..........

The arm MUST BE in a position to be moving FORWARD when reaction force is transfered rearward........Otherwise you completely waste the energy created by PLANT INTO THE GROUND..........

I explain in detail in this thread from last year from James.........

Thanks BM,
while I agree with you on 99% of what your saying, I also have to respectfully disagree with the arms timing in refrence to the toe or heel plant. Its the heel planting and firming up kineticaly that creates the ground force. If the timing of the arm is off too drastically, the GRF will not be able to be transferred into the whip efficiently.

Coach,

The foot and heel do not create ground force... the energy forward/downward does. They are but mere receivers... and as distally positioned as possible from the ball. Once they receive it... it's the linkages upstream that really do the delivering, like the hip AB/ADductors.

BM is absolutely correct in my opinion, it's the timing of events before touch down that make the difference. There are far too many variables with each pitcher to pin a time on... even though I do enjoy the 200, 9:55 PST references Ken makes... Iron out the first two points, and the last will happen as it should... for that particular athlete.

coach james said:

Thanks BM,
while I agree with you on 99% of what your saying, I also have to respectfully disagree with the arms timing in refrence to the toe or heel plant. Its the heel planting and firming up kineticaly that creates the ground force. If the timing of the arm is off too drastically, the GRF will not be able to be transferred into the whip efficiently.

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James, you're not disagreeing with anything I said. The timing of the arm position is ONLY critical as it relates to GFR.......That's what I said........And that's what you said.......

Toe touch doesn't mean crap period...........Heel plant doesn't mean crap if the leg is still in the process of firming.

It isn't until the foot is completely planted with the leg COMPLETELY FIRMED UP that ground reaction force occurs transferring energy back up the chain........

These clips are all paused before, then PAUSED AGAIN at the moment GRF begins to occur. Notice where ALL THEIR ARMS ARE when the ground PUSHES BACK.........





Some are "toe-touchers", some are "foot planters".........But all have their arms at 9:00 when ground reaction force occurs.........

I read that wrong. I thought you were saying it's fine to have the ball where ever it wants (even past 9) just as long as your firming up and creating the force. By reading it like that, the force generated wouldn't have sufficient time to transfer into the arm for whip. My mistake.

javasource said:

There are far too many variables with each pitcher to pin a time on... even though I do enjoy the 150, 9:55 DFP Standard Time references Ken makes...

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...fixed that...

BoardMember said:

Some are "toe-touchers", some are "foot planters".........But all have their arms at 9:00 when ground reaction force occurs.........

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#15 Farish Beard R-R 6-0 P Sr. Fairhope, Ala. / Fairhope HS