Back at it...again 12yr old DD

softball_mom#7 said:

She has never pitched "hello elbow" as it has always felt extremely unnatural. One of her new coaches preaches "hello elbow" and she is fighting it all the way. I just noticed one of her pitches kinda finishes like that...ugh!

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Would you like a .gif of her pitching?

I would get a pitching rubber, or at least have her dig a hole to push off of. I would have her do every pitch by the rules. Seems she is really hurrying.

approach,shake on/off the call,collect....

Perfect Circle said:

Would you like a .gif of her pitching?

I would get a pitching rubber, or at least have her dig a hole to push off of. I would have her do every pitch by the rules. Seems she is really hurrying.

approach,shake on/off the call,collect....

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That is my fault. We have a pitching rubber and I forgot it that day.

Out in Left Field said:

When we evaluate pain we look to see if is from "restarting" or soreness. That goes away with movement. Yes muscles can be stiff, but a knot that does not go away is sign of an injury. An injury has to be treated before changing mechanics, whether throwing or any kind of physical motion.

We look at motions for the shoulder that are too long for the joint, lateral movement of the shoulder, lack of resistance and poor posture. Kids whose hips pull them through when pitching often complain of pain in the upper shoulder or back, as do kids who walk through the end of the pitch. Along with that, young kids who turn to face shoulders perpendicular to home and whip through that way (often with high HE but not the make the bicep kind) often complain of pain. The bicep kind get pain nearer the elbow.

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Poor posture is a definite for her. I am constantly on her about it. Unfortunately, I don't know enough or have a trained eye regarding the other situations you mentioned. Are these all things you see?

She doesn't have any pain when throwing over hand, only when going through her pitching motion and not every time she pitches. I will get in touch with her pediatrician next week. Thank you for taking the time to comment.

She seems to be landing on a bent knee. She needs a firm front (left) side. It should mirror her legs in overhand throw. Last night, I had 2 girls push against a small ramp, with that left leg. That helped them keep their weight back.

But - she isn't bad. I saw 3 of my 10U students last night that looked like they had never had a lesson in their life. Your DD is much better than that. As far as the muscle pain, I think you are doing the right thing in looking at her warm up. Does it start hurting right away, or could she go 25 pitches before it hurts? She is going to have to distinguish between pain and soreness. Soreness should go away, in a few days, as she strengthens her arm, stomach, back, etc. Pain will hit and stay and re-occur. Pitching should not hurt.

Thank you Amy. When it hurts it is usually 60 pitches or so in. After she rests a a day or two she is fine. After rest and she asks for me to catch her, I respond with how are you feeling. She is honest about how much pain, if any. If she is sore at all we don't pitch. I get sore in the same spot when I am hunched over my desk while sitting in my crappy work chair for too long. I've been giving her massages and making her stretch daily. I wanted to have the expert eyes here review the video to see if she was off somewhere that might be causing it and what we can do here to help her fix it.

Thanks again!

The area you describe is the rhomboid and serratus region. Frequent use can definitely make this area sore and knotty. A tennis ball can work wonders in working those knots out, when in a pinch.

That area of the back is quite the cluster area, and often misleading when tracking an issue down, because muscles run in all directions. The pecs can actually be causing that... posture can... throwing can... etc. Point being, tracking it down can be a booger. If the soreness has become regular, even after resting it a couple days and then resuming... that's telling you that there is an underlying weakness, and it's easy to address with a light conditioning and solid warm-up routine. Here's a sample... Raised arm shoulder shrugs are good, too. Add in some stretches and exercises that target the serratus... as this is a frequent weakness/culprit in athletes that have similar soreness issues.

Doug is right, she is reloading down the circle... her hand turns out over-top because she opens a bit late. I'd really make palm up a focus for her.

Also, her reverse posture is pretty extreme... it wouldn't be a bad thing to get her a little more upright.

Lastly, her backswing/upswing is creating quite the pinch in her scap area... and as a result, the backswing is really tweaking her torso. IMO, the 2 best ways to take the ball back AND bring it up the circle are with the hand oriented in one of these resting positions (when arm is at side): 1) Handshake position 2) back of hand to catcher. Either way... getting your hand on top of the ball by 3 is recommended. I'd NEVER recommend bringing the ball up the circle with the palm-up... it creates issues over the top of the circle if they don't correct it very early.

P.S. - What size are her feet?!

OK before I get side tracked I want to thank you both for sharing information. I am mostly a visual learner so I am sure everyone in the house will think I'm nuts when I physically start attempting to position my hand, etc... in hopes to convey the information correctly. So to clarify, pull the ball not push up through the circle? So, at 12 the ball should be where? Facing toward the catcher? (She has previously taken lessons with Doug Gillis; we are on the waiting list for a spot again)
I will continue to hound her about her posture.

Lmao...her feet. She wears a size 6.5 and is 5ft tall. She has always had big feet. For the longest time her feet were the only part of her body that seemed to be growing. I was starting to get concerned until her most recent physical when we were told she has grown an inch and a half in the last couple months. So hopefully she is growing into her feet.

I'm going to read the articles and posts again in between games tomorrow. Thank you again! Hope you all are having a great weekend!!

6.5? That's nuthin'! My 10U DD wears 10.5 and is 5.4 (No joking here!) Buying clothes, shoes and gear is getting crazy!

Ken B said:

6.5? That's nuthin'! My 10U DD wears 10.5 and is 5.4 (No joking here!) Buying clothes, shoes and gear is getting crazy!

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We had 2 girls on our 10U team that were 5'8. The coaches always made sure the had copies of their birth certificates, lol. Are you and mom both tall? My DD is hoping to grow another foot (genetics are not in her favor, lol) but doctors are projecting 5'6-5'7. She's late starting her growth spurt. I can't imagine a size 10.5 shoe at age 10.

Out in Left Field said:

I want to make it clear I am talking about arm circle. I am not a fan of backswings and we don't teach them.

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Yes sir, thank you for clarifying. I know Doug doesn't use one and I am sure he had a list of things to correct with her. He made 1st priority was her balance, which is better but not completely corrected. I noticed in video footage from yesterday she is still falling a bit to the right.

I was half awake last night posting so I am going to re-read the posts so we can prioritize and get a game plan together until we can see Doug. I looked up a few coaches in our area but am hesitant to switch because she really enjoys learning from him. I only wish she would have listened when I told her last year at this time that she isn't just taking lessons for her current team it is a long haul commitment if she wants to be good. Doug offered her some very encouraging words at her last lesson. I would try to remind her of those when she was frustrated but I'm "mom" and I lost my intelligence apparently during childbirth, LOL.

I really want everyone who stopped by to know how grateful I am for their time and posts. When we started back on this journey and I had questions this was the first place I thought to go. The wealth of knowledge here is unsurpassable. It is truly a collaboration of individuals who share a love and a passion for the game; individuals whom want others to succeed without a personal agenda of their own. I really should stop by more often....