IR versus "Hello Elbow"

I do not want to provide misinformation

That site can polish it and rebrand it if they want but why the emphasis on what happens after the point of release? The important stuff happens between 12 o'clock and release.

see above- post deleted

I'm glad that you're finding insight, how ever you find it, that helps you explain things.

I watched the video and found it to be too wordy, and it misses an important point, which is the actual internal ROTATION of the forearm. There's more going on then simply the elbow joint.

Hold your arms straight out to your sides, palm up. Bend your elbows so that your forearms are now about 20 degrees above your shoulders. Now rotate your hand forward (so your thumb comes over the top) while maintaining this bend. Your hand will move from 20 degrees above your bicep to 20 degrees under your bicep.

This motion of turning your forearm is the absolute quickest motion your body can make. Martial artists have used this for centuries to allow very powerful blocks without needing to move the arm but an inch or two. The important factor left out of this video is not that the elbow must lead by pointing down, but that the hand must be palm up and finish palm down (although by this point the arm has moved so the palm is facing the catcher).

We call this arm whip. If you practice this, you'll see that wrist snaps are actually counter-productive when using correct arm whip, which is why you'll get a lot of issue with that concept on these forums. Wrist snaps belong in the bucket of "how grampa did it in the 70's" along with squishing the bug and chicken winging for batting.

-W

Hi everyone, I'm Phil, the one in the video that was originally posted here. I received notification of this discussion via trackback comment on my blog and was just able to come view this message board. I appreciate your feedback and would like to offer a few responses to all of your comments.

First of all, I do not teach the concept of a "point" of release. Release takes place in a "zone," which I find enables the athlete to conceptualize continuous acceleration. Just as acceleration and extension are crucial after contact with a pitched ball in hitting, so are acceleration and extension crucial in the delivery of a pitch for maximum speed and command. Yes, the ball has left your hand, and yes, from 12 o'clock through the release is the most important component of the arm delivery, but knowing that the pitch does not end at the point that the ball leaves your hand is equally important.

Second, internal rotation in a relaxed arm and forearm will happen naturally so long as the aggressive movement upward, which is prevalent in elbow snap, or the tensing and stopping of the hand at release, does not take place. This video was an answer to a specific inquiry regarding the conceptual difference between elbow snap and forearm fire (or whatever term you happen to use for that type of release).

Thanks again for your feedback and I welcome further comments.

Phil, I'd like to see this video........Please post a link to it.........

Phil said:

Hi everyone, I'm Phil, the one in the video that was originally posted here. I received notification of this discussion via trackback comment on my blog and was just able to come view this message board. I appreciate your feedback and would like to offer a few responses to all of your comments.

First of all, I do not teach the concept of a "point" of release. Release takes place in a "zone," which I find enables the athlete to conceptualize continuous acceleration. Just as acceleration and extension are crucial after contact with a pitched ball in hitting, so are acceleration and extension crucial in the delivery of a pitch for maximum speed and command. Yes, the ball has left your hand, and yes, from 12 o'clock through the release is the most important component of the arm delivery, but knowing that the pitch does not end at the point that the ball leaves your hand is equally important.

Second, internal rotation in a relaxed arm and forearm will happen naturally so long as the aggressive movement upward, which is prevalent in elbow snap, or the tensing and stopping of the hand at release, does not take place. This video was an answer to a specific inquiry regarding the conceptual difference between elbow snap and forearm fire (or whatever term you happen to use for that type of release).

Thanks again for your feedback and I welcome further comments.

Click to expand...

HELLO!.......Link please!

Since the maker of the video is able to track the discussion - I will re-post the link which can be found at:

Video: Windmill Pitching Release Mechanics


I found the visual demonstration of IR - although it's not spelled out in the same way- very helpful to me personally which is why I put the link in the first place, as I thought other neophyte parents would find the visual representation helpful. Boardmember has since posted a video of himself (? I guess) and that is helpful too. Thank you.

Perhaps it is because I viewed other videos on the site- I took away from it that is the motion of the forearm that creates the speed as this is what is emphasized in the prior video. Also, as I said before, having had the video when I was trying to teach my DD IR- would have provided good ammunition so I had something to refer back to- when she questioned me as to why I was "trying something new on her that I read on the internet when her coach (old coach now) does not teach that"

Wrist snap will take place naturally as part of relaxed acceleration of the hand and forearm through the "throw zone" (what we call forearm fire). The snapping of the wrist is not limited to one direction, such as an upside-down "bye bye" wave. The internal rotation of the forearm during delivery, if the forearm is relaxed, will result in a natural whip of the wrist similar to the tip of snapped towel. The wrist will snap slightly differently depending on what type of pitch you are throwing. For those of you who requested the link to the video being discussed here it is Video: Windmill Pitching Release Mechanics

Thanks for the video. That was a good way of describing the action of the arm and the follow through.