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Thread: Front Side Resistance

  1. #11
    Certified softball maniac RayR's Avatar
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    No one would take shots if you just eased up on the whole "the way I teach it is the best way and everyone else's way sucks" routine you have been shelling out recently.....especially when you admit you were not even teaching the back leg action the same way others do.....but thought you were.....

    Carry on

    Quote Originally Posted by Wellphyt View Post
    Agree about the back foot. I'm not sure if it's fixable because of her rear knee to hip alignment issue she was born with:
    Attachment 1768

    Her back foot is square when she starts. It did slip back some in these swings because of "The Move", but I don't think that accounts for all of the backward turn. The only way I think it could be fixed is to have her do no dynamic loading and keep her legs to where she has almost no knee bend. Because when she bends her back leg with the way her back knee and hip are aligned, it accentuates the turn-in of the back knee and never looks right to me. You should see her run LOL. It's something I've had to learn to teach around. Next time we're at the cages, on concrete in her running shoes I'll video it to see what it looks like with zero slippage. Probably not much better.

    Yes, this is about the front side, but hey, people need to get in their shots when they can. I'm a big boy, I can handle it. I've never one time claimed that my DD's swing was perfect. The reason we work on it is because we're always trying to improve it.
    A Great American Truth Seeker, Friend of Raffy

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    Certified softball maniac Wellphyt's Avatar
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    Here are images of Williams' lower half and Hamilton. Their forward hip turn is timed with the opening of the front side. They stay closed until they reach the point of transition when their hips reverse and begin to turn forward. Many kids will open their front side way before their hips begin to turn forward. IMO having a goal of letting the forward hip turn open up the front side can pay dividends.

    ted closed to open.JPG

    hamilton closed to open.JPG

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    Certified softball maniac Wellphyt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTS View Post
    No one would take shots if you just eased up on the whole "the way I teach it is the best way and everyone else's way sucks" routine you have been shelling out recently.....especially when you admit you were not even teaching the back leg action the same way others do.....but thought you were.....

    Carry on
    Could you please explain the part in bold? What back leg action am I not teaching that I thought I was?

    Also for the record, I agree a lot with what several other posters on here teach. Others I agree with some of the time but not all of the time. I can't think of anyone that I don't agree with at least some of time.

    Also, thanks for bringing up my DD's back foot. It got me thinking more about what I can do to try and compensate for her knee to hip alignment issue that she was born with.

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    Certified softball maniac RayR's Avatar
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    You mentioned that you had taught your daughter to turn the back knee down and in as part of the Elvis move.....and thought it was the wrong path.....no one advised anywhere on this board that the Elvis move has you actively turning the back knee down and in....
    A Great American Truth Seeker, Friend of Raffy

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    Softball Junkie tom.guerry's Avatar
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    see the ted/wassup youtube:

    ted williams swing in slo motion with breakdown of rotational mechanics - YouTube

    See phase 2 around 40 sec mark:

    While front foot opens there is a forward push using rear foot as base and "pull hands back to wind upper body"

    This upper body resistance/synch is the key regardless of when/whether front foot opens.

    REAR side resistance
    Last edited by tom.guerry; 03-08-2012 at 09:20 PM.

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    I eat, sleep and breathe softball FiveFrameSwing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTS View Post
    No one would take shots if you just eased up on the whole "the way I teach it is the best way and everyone else's way sucks" routine you have been shelling out recently.....especially when you admit you were not even teaching the back leg action the same way others do.....but thought you were.....

    Carry on
    IMO Wellphyt gives a reasonable explanations for why he believes what he believes. You do as well. Enjoy posts from the both of you.

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    I eat, sleep and breathe softball FiveFrameSwing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom.guerry View Post
    see the ted/wassup youtube:

    ted williams swing in slo motion with breakdown of rotational mechanics - YouTube

    See phase 2 around 40 sec mark:

    While front foot opens there is a forward push using rear foot as base and "pull hands back to wind upper body"

    This upper body resistance/synch is the key regardless of when/whether front foot opens.

    REAR side resistance
    Thank you Tom. Feel free to add more.

  8. #18
    Certified softball maniac Wellphyt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTS View Post
    You mentioned that you had taught your daughter to turn the back knee down and in as part of the Elvis move.....and thought it was the wrong path.....no one advised anywhere on this board that the Elvis move has you actively turning the back knee down and in....
    Thanks for the clarification. I'm not going to go back and dig up every single quote that I've ever written on here about the back leg. Instead I'll save myself some time and simply clarify my view on the back leg. I believe I have been consistent in talking about maintaining pressure at the back foot until the hips reverse. When I was teaching my DD to simultaneously drop the front heel while lifting the back heel (my definition of the Elvis), it promoted an action where her hips would not begin to turn forward until she performed the "Elvis". I view the "Elvis" move as an active use of the back leg. IMO there is little to no distinction between doing the "Elvis" move and turning the back knee down-and-in. When performing the "Elvis" move, the back knee does in fact begin to turn in.

    I abandoned the "Elvis" move in favor of maintaining pressure at the back foot until the hips transition from turning back to turning forward. IOW IMO it is much better to have the weight shift cause the "Elvis" move, than it is to have the "Elvis" move cause the weight shift.

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    Certified softball maniac RayR's Avatar
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    That's fine....but there are many who teach the "Elvis" with much success....it is disrespectful to the instructors, parents and players to come on this board and beat it up...if you think the "move" is a better way - that's good by me....

    IOW IMO it is much better to have the weight shift cause the "Elvis" move, than it is to have the "Elvis" move cause the weight shift.
    I use a modified Yee kicking drill as my primary way to teach weight transfer....I am getting very good results eliminating bug squishing/spinning.....but we usually start with getting comfortable with walking off the back heel which is somewhat an elvis move...

    I wish I had some before clips so we could see a before and after....but trust me....not much weight was being transferred as they were TAUGHT to squish the bug....

    9th grade


    10th grade


    8th grade


    This one is still fighting not getting the front foot down earlier in her sequence (watch the flip of the front foot as the hands drop)....so as her hands are still dropping as she is late getting off the back foot....but according to her summer coach she looks like a different hitter....8th grader....I plan on having her do more reverse top hand drills as well



    Front side resistance for me is learning to get comfortable getting the front foot planted earlier.....so it forces you to transfer your weight from the back....I believe the hands want to follow the weight.....if you are spinning on the back foot you hands will stay back longer (in the form of dropping or the front arm lengthening creating a sweeping swing)....when you get used to transferring off the back foot your hands start moving forward a bit quicker and that alone will give you a better chance at hitting the ball with oommphh...
    A Great American Truth Seeker, Friend of Raffy

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  12. #20
    Certified softball maniac Wellphyt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom.guerry View Post
    see the ted/wassup youtube:

    ted williams swing in slo motion with breakdown of rotational mechanics - YouTube

    See phase 2 around 40 sec mark:

    While front foot opens there is a forward push using rear foot as base and "pull hands back to wind upper body"

    This upper body resistance/synch is the key regardless of when/whether front foot opens.

    REAR side resistance
    I've seen this video before and IMO it is a very poor interpretation of what Ted said he did. Just one more instance of someone ignoring what Ted said he did and using their own believe system to describe what Ted did. One of the biggest revelations I had after reading "TSOH", was how so much of what Ted said has been distorted over the years.

    Probably the most blatant distortion is the "you have to go back before you can go forward" cue that so many instructors and coaches use. Every time I've seen this cue used by D1 coaches, it's always accompanied by the coaches shifting weight onto the back foot; which is not at all what Ted meant.

    Regarding the video, I have never read anything from Ted saying he "used his rear foot to push forward". IMO he would not agree that he was actively pushing forward with his back foot during the stride, or actively pushing with his rear foot to open his hips. When I hear the term "pushing with the back foot" I envision a kid actively and forcefully pushing off the ground with their rear foot. That's not what Ted did.

    During the stride he specifically said that you fight against coming forward. You should only come forward enough to keep yourself balanced. That doesn't sound like an active push off the ground to me.

    Then there is the weight shift or opening of the hips. Ted always describes that action as using the hips or the butt.

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