Thread: Softball Swing vs. Baseball Swing - 2

What I see in the clips of the hitters is their hands stay set in launch after load and then the process of unloading the swing creates seperation.

I'd like to warn the readers, (and anyone else on a quest to learn about hitting), anytime the acronym PCR(W) vs. MLB is used to downplay the basic fundementals of a good swing, buyer beware. Understanding that you cannot put a "label" on a good swing is paramount to remaining objective in the learning process.

One should also beware of long diatribes that attempt to explain things out of context in order to muddy the waters of what consitutes the sound fundementals of a good swing.

That being said, lets review 2 swings, and specifically the analysis contained in the comments below:

Originally Posted by tom.guerry

the ULL girl has good shoulder tilt. not such good handle torque which gives her the more rigid "Box maintenance" look.

The term "rigid box maintainence" is often misused without regard to the severe inside location of the pitch to drive a particular theory or explaination of what constitutes a sound fundamental swing.

Here is a clip of one of the best hitters in the world exibiting what is termed as "rigid box maintainence" to fight off the severe inside location of the pitch. The move IS a sound fundemental of a good swing that stops a hitter from moving out TOO early and hooking the ball foul:




Moving on:

Originally Posted by tom.guerry

the Stanford hitter has the 1 plane type swing/minimal shoulder tilt with excessive counterrotation.

Here again, we are faced with making sure we understand sound fundamentals that allow hitters to create power and plane matching using a particular loading/unloading style that best suits the individual hitter.

In the case of Michele Smith, who exibits a "pre-stride-no-stride" load/unload pattern, counter rotation is used with hipcock to "wind the rubber band" while keeping the spine from exibiting excessive misalignment prior to unloading one of the most powerful swings in softball.

In the comment above, the "blogger" uses the term "excessive counter rotation" in combination with an earlier comment regarding PCR(W).

See below:

the PCR/W blueprint, on the other hand encourages attributes of the 1 plane/single plane/swing around pattern. the single plane golf swing requires lots of early x-factor in the backswing which is unacceptable excessive counter-rotation in hitting.

Now to the truth of the matter.

Whether a hitter exibits counter rotation or not, the only consideration should be whether that hitter is able to "unload" THAT loading pattern ON TIME and ON PLANE.

The bottom line is all that matters in terms of a particular loading/unloading pattern. Have a look at 2 of the best "counter rotators in the world. The one on the right is the SAME hitter the "blogger" says is exibiting "excessive counter rotation" in the previous post:



Again, anytime you read a "blog" that uses the acronym PCR(W) to downplay the particular fundamentals of any sound swing, BUYER BEWARE.........

Now back to our regularly scheduled program:

Posey?.......Your thoughts/views on my original post?

Originally Posted by Teacher

What I see in the clips of the hitters is their hands stay set in launch after load and then the process of unloading the swing creates seperation.

Teacher, I'm out of time this morning. This evening I'll try to shed some light on the subject.

Here are 2 questions in the meantime:

1.) When is "load" in a simple sentence or two.

2.) When is "launch" in a simple sentence or two.

TTYL..........

Originally Posted by BoardMember

Teacher, I'm out of time this morning. This evening I'll try to shed some light on the subject.

Here are 2 questions in the meantime:

1.) When is "load" in a simple sentence or two.

2.) When is "launch" in a simple sentence or two.

TTYL..........

As a quick follow up, here is a clip of the same hitter who the "blogger" says is displaying "rigid box maintainence" do to the PCR(W) blue print. This time, she is not jammed on the inside. Feel free to compare........

Board Member,

1.) Are the shoulders turning inward and/or hands loading back in relation to their starting position, AS they make their "positive move forward"?
-Their hands are seperating bc they are moving forward.

2.) Are the hips opening INTO foot plant?
-Can you please explain what you are asking here? Are you asking are their hips opening before or after "foot plant"?

Load is when the front side goes down into the back side turning into the plate. Launch is when the legs start to uncoil the hips, torso , arms and shoulders.

Originally Posted by TeamPosey13

Board Member,

1.) Are the shoulders turning inward and/or hands loading back in relation to their starting position, AS they make their "positive move forward"?
-Their hands are seperating bc they are moving forward.

Very good. Without being too picky, you understand that IF the body is moving forward and the hands are traveling from a position inside the rear shoulder to outside the shoulder during this time, the hitter is loading them back in order to hold them back in this position right?

Regardless, AS THEY STRIDE, the hands are separating from the direction of the stride.

Here is your previous statement:

2. You cannot create seperation when you load. If your hands go backwards while you are loading... you are done and your bat drags and it is hard to catch up to the ball. Your hands load in one motion with your legs.

OK, So maybe we've shed some light in this area?.........

Going forward:

Originally Posted by TeamPosey13

2.) Are the hips opening INTO foot plant?
-Can you please explain what you are asking here? Are you asking are their hips opening before or after "foot plant"?

Yes..........

Here is your previous statement:

3. Good hitting instructors do not teach hips opening.

Originally Posted by TeamPosey13

Load is when the front side goes down into the back side turning into the plate. Launch is when the legs start to uncoil the hips, torso , arms and shoulders.

Very good. So what we're discussing is whether top side is loading/creating separation during the negetive move or positive move........

Originally Posted by TeamPosey13

Load is when the front side goes down into the back side turning into the plate. Launch is when the legs start to uncoil the hips, torso , arms and shoulders.

Interesting. To me, leave off the last two words and the hands are still loading back and the shoulder is still loading at that point. To me, launch is at heel drop and or first movement of the bathead into the swing plane. It's good to understand these definitional semantic differences in terms so we don't end up having two arguments together with neither of us understanding the other. Carry on.

Some more clips to ponder regarding WHEN the top half load actually happens to create separation, and assist in countering the URGE to open the top to early due to teaching "everything MUST move as one unit", as stated by Candrea in his sport-skool video........: