DD getting ready for the new year

Hyp, i am trying visulize what you are trying to explain. Coil foward and drive the rear hip through the ball? is this close? And you say, hold the coil, even as they, the hips counter rotate (open}

I cannot see the rear hip, but i can see the front hip. If i load this clip up in kinovia, and put dots on the front line on his pants, his hip moves in an arc. He gets "sat" really well, something i am just seeing in clips.
another thing i see, is seperation, between hip and torso, hips turn, but shoulders do not. This seems to be a big part of elite hitters "eliteness" And i think this tension, creates the explosive, and quickness, .....not holding the tightness in the rear hip. (at this time). i can always change my mind, if something convinces me otherwise. I do see the lineal component of the hips, its not a true circle, but they do turn.

I can see you throwing your hands in the air Hyp sorry....... i do like what you say, still looking for the ultimite way to teach hitting.

IMO the base of the spine is following a linear path but the hips are indeed rotating. They have to in order to get from closed to open in a swing. When the rear hip is lower than the front hip in a swing it gives the illusion of firing straighter but in reality they are still rotating but on a different plane....the z axis if you will.

mann said:

Hyp, i am trying visulize what you are trying to explain. Coil foward and drive the rear hip through the ball? is this close? And you say, hold the coil, even as they, the hips counter rotate (open}

I cannot see the rear hip, but i can see the front hip. If i load this clip up in kinovia, and put dots on the front line on his pants, his hip moves in an arc. He gets "sat" really well, something i am just seeing in clips.
another thing i see, is seperation, between hip and torso, hips turn, but shoulders do not. This seems to be a big part of elite hitters "eliteness" And i think this tension, creates the explosive, and quickness, .....not holding the tightness in the rear hip. (at this time). i can always change my mind, if something convinces me otherwise. I do see the lineal component of the hips, its not a true circle, but they do turn.

I can see you throwing your hands in the air Hyp sorry....... i do like what you say, still looking for the ultimite way to teach hitting.

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The rear hip has a linear directional force through through the ball. I say hold the coil but IMO, in reality the rear hip keeps coiling. It doesn't truly counter rotate. To me, that would be coil to uncoil.

Did you do the pencil test I explained? The hips are coiling in one direction and continue in that direction. They don't turn one direction to just turn back the other direction. If you are moving about a "circle" you are headed in one direction but the direction can be towards the infield or towards the catcher but it is in the same direction. The rear hip coil is headed in one direction. I keep it moving in that one direction. I do not move in one direction just to reverse that direction.

If I coil the rear hip in one direction. In order to do that I have to start tightening certain muscles. I feel it in my lower back and in my upper rear butt cheek. If I just reverse that movement, I lose that tightness. To me that is slop or slack. Then the rear hip has to move a certain distance to take out the slop, before it grabs the hands again.

If I maintain that tightness and keep the rear hip coming around on the original coil path. The tightness never goes away. I now have direct connection between the rear hip and the hands. No slop or slack. So when the rear leg drives the rear hip then the hands have instant feedback and connection to the rear hip. The rear hip will also be coming from the inside of the ball and not out and around.

Perfect about what you see in the front hip. That is correct. The front hip does get rotated back but as you say, you can see the rear hip moving in a "linear" fashion. As the rear femur moves down and forward, that is forcing the hips open. Since the rear hip has been coiled and that coil is being maintained and trying to stay linear. That is forcing the front hip around and back.

So, technically the hips rotate around the base of the spine but the base of the spine is being moved back as well. In my eyes this gives the appearance that the pelvis is being pivoted around the rear femur. I will try to explain that. The rear femur is moving down and forward in as straight of a line as possible. The rear hip is pivoting on top of the rear femur. The lower spine is being pushed back and out of the way. The front hip is being forced open, around and back. The only thing that is stay fairly constant is the rear femur moving linear and rear hip pivoting on top of that.

As far as the separation between upper and lower. Yes, there will be separation between upper and lower but IMO that is not what is important. I can create that separation by coiling to uncoil. That would be filled with slop/slack. If I coil the rear hip and keep it coiling, and as I described above about the femur moving down and forward in a straight line, this opens the pelvis so I have upper and lower separation. The difference is I now have rear femur/rear hip to hand separation and I have the tightness in the rear hip with a direct connection to the hands. Now the rear leg/hip can move linear from the inside of the ball and pull the hands in a linear path from the inside of the ball.

Yes, the hips do open but it is the why and how they open that is important. They don't open just because I open them. They open because of the coil and coil some more.

JMHO

If anyone has a question on coiling EVER... Or ever feels the need to write the word "uncoil"....PLEASE read Hyp's post and TRY IT. Seems like there is so much misunderstanding, when all the answers have been given. Try it try it try it...learn to hit before or at least while you are teaching and debating how to hit.

redhotcoach said:

If anyone has a question on coiling EVER... Or ever feels the need to write the word "uncoil"....PLEASE read Hyp's post and TRY IT. Seems like there is so much misunderstanding, when all the answers have been given. Try it try it try it...learn to hit before or at least while you are teaching and debating how to hit.

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Thanks, I thought it might be confusing. Very hard to explain in words.

if you turn the back foot in and cock your front knee even just a little you should feel the muscles in your lower back and butt tighten . then how do you keep those muscles tight is the answer . the explanation of the rear hip joint taking an inside path should be the focus . once you coil the rear hip - similar to your hands - don't sweep the rear hip joint .

.sorry

Hype, some things you say defy logic."It doesn't truly counter rotate. To me, that would be coil to uncoil."
I try to wrap my mind around that, but the hips go one way then the other, that is counter rotate.

Also you say.."The front hip is being forced open, around and back"

BY the REAR leg?? Why are you leaving out the front leg? The front leg POPS at contact, the back leg has become useless long before this.
I DO teach a slight pigeon toe at stance, i like them to feel that tightness, as they coil foward, but at a certain point, the rear leg can do no more.

redhotcoach said:

If anyone has a question on coiling EVER... Or ever feels the need to write the word "uncoil"....PLEASE read Hyp's post and TRY IT. Seems like there is so much misunderstanding, when all the answers have been given. Try it try it try it...learn to hit before or at least while you are teaching and debating how to hit.

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The hip actively coils. It gets uncoiled.

mann said:

.sorry

Hype, some things you say defy logic."It doesn't truly counter rotate. To me, that would be coil to uncoil."
I try to wrap my mind around that, but the hips go one way then the other, that is counter rotate.

Also you say.."The front hip is being forced open, around and back"

BY the REAR leg?? Why are you leaving out the front leg? The front leg POPS at contact, the back leg has become useless long before this.
I DO teach a slight pigeon toe at stance, i like them to feel that tightness, as they coil foward, but at a certain point, the rear leg can do no more.

Click to expand...

Did you do what I asked you to try with the pencil? You may or may not have an ah ha moment.

Do you understand that if I am moving in an arc, that I am only headed in one direction? If I was driving a car in drive around in a circle. I am driving in one direction. Lets put a pitcher on one side of the circle and a catcher on the other side. As I come around the circle I am headed towards the pitcher and at some point in the circle I will be headed towards the catcher but I am still driving in the same direction.

What coil to uncoil is like, would be putting the car in drive and driving part way around the circle and then placing it in reverse to go back around the corner.

Why would I want to stop the hip and then restart it in the opposite direction? Why not just keep it driving in the same direction?

You see the front leg POP at contact and automatically think that means the hitter is automatically timing a push back. It would have to be a timed push back to do it at the correct time every time. So, the hitter not only has to time the barrel, the rear hip, and the hands, he has to time the lead leg push back too? Ever notice that Pro hitters very rarely miss time the lead leg push back? Notice that it always seems to be on time? There is a reason for that, and it is because they are not pushing back to straighten the front leg. The front leg gets straightened because of something else.

The rear femur moving down and forward does in fact open the pelvis. As the rear femur is working under the rear hip it is moving as linear as possible from the inside. This is causing the front hip to continue to move back and around. The lead leg is firm keeping the torso from drifting forward. The lead hip is moving away from the front foot. The rear hip/rear femur has created max stretch against the hands. The barrel is completing it's arc and the stretch is then released. The rear hip/rear femur then pops forward because the resistance of the hands and barrel have been overcome. This makes the lead hip suddenly move back a little more with suddenness, which snaps/POPS the lead leg straight. That is why it POPS straight on time every time. It is not a timing move of the front leg.

Notice how in some amateurs that the lead leg will never firm up or will lock out to early? Because they are trying to time a push back.

Let me try a spring analogy. Take a spring and twist it tight. Now, let out a little of the bottom tightness (rear hip uncoil) Then let it all go at once. Some of the energy will be lost through the bottom and some through the top (rear hip rotation)

Now, if I take the spring and twist it tight and maintain a firm grip on the bottom (rear hip coil) and just let go of the top. All of the energy is released through the top (coil and coil some more).

The top of the spring is the hands/barrel. The bottom is the rear hip/rear femur. I want the energy to be released through the barrel. I don't want any of it to be released out of the hips.

Let me ask you a question. How does a hitter maintain a tightness/connection in the rear hip when it is uncoiled?

Would this crude drawing spell out the differences of the direction of the rear hip?

HYP said:

Did you do what I asked you to try with the pencil? You may or may not have an ah ha moment.

Do you understand that if I am moving in an arc, that I am only headed in one direction? If I was driving a car in drive around in a circle. I am driving in one direction. Lets put a pitcher on one side of the circle and a catcher on the other side. As I come around the circle I am headed towards the pitcher and at some point in the circle I will be headed towards the catcher but I am still driving in the same direction.

What coil to uncoil is like, would be putting the car in drive and driving part way around the circle and then placing it in reverse to go back around the corner.

Why would I want to stop the hip and then restart it in the opposite direction? Why not just keep it driving in the same direction?

You see the front leg POP at contact and automatically think that means the hitter is automatically timing a push back. It would have to be a timed push back to do it at the correct time every time. So, the hitter not only has to time the barrel, the rear hip, and the hands, he has to time the lead leg push back too? Ever notice that Pro hitters very rarely miss time the lead leg push back? Notice that it always seems to be on time? There is a reason for that, and it is because they are not pushing back to straighten the front leg. The front leg gets straightened because of something else.

The rear femur moving down and forward does in fact open the pelvis. As the rear femur is working under the rear hip it is moving as linear as possible from the inside. This is causing the front hip to continue to move back and around. The lead leg is firm keeping the torso from drifting forward. The lead hip is moving away from the front foot. The rear hip/rear femur has created max stretch against the hands. The barrel is completing it's arc and the stretch is then released. The rear hip/rear femur then pops forward because the resistance of the hands and barrel have been overcome. This makes the lead hip suddenly move back a little more with suddenness, which snaps/POPS the lead leg straight. That is why it POPS straight on time every time. It is not a timing move of the front leg.

Notice how in some amateurs that the lead leg will never firm up or will lock out to early? Because they are trying to time a push back.

Let me try a spring analogy. Take a spring and twist it tight. Now, let out a little of the bottom tightness (rear hip uncoil) Then let it all go at once. Some of the energy will be lost through the bottom and some through the top (rear hip rotation)

Now, if I take the spring and twist it tight and maintain a firm grip on the bottom (rear hip coil) and just let go of the top. All of the energy is released through the top (coil and coil some more).

The top of the spring is the hands/barrel. The bottom is the rear hip/rear femur. I want the energy to be released through the barrel. I don't want any of it to be released out of the hips.

Let me ask you a question. How does a hitter maintain a tightness/connection in the rear hip when it is uncoiled?

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