Whose error is it anyways?

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softgabby

Gear Empress
Mar 10, 2016
1,073
83
Just behind home plate
Ok, I have a question for you guys...

We're playing a make up game from over the weekend today (too much rain and the fields being in bad shape). In the game, we're down 12-10 in the away half of the 4th (we're home). There are 2 outs and the count is 2 balls, 1 strike, runner on first. I see the runner take off from first when the ball is released from the pitcher's hand. The batter swings and misses at the rise ball putting me in perfect position to keep coming up to throw. I throw a strike down to second. My short stop comes running over, but never catching the ball even though the ball was thrown to the perfect spot and the ball had beaten the runner to the base. The ball rolls into right-center field and the runner advances to third.

We get back into the dugout after I talked to the pitcher and calmed her down thinking she did something wrong and she struck out the batter with a nasty change up. The shortstop and I argue over who was at fault on the play. I claim she didn't get over in time to catch the ball. She claims I threw the ball too quickly and too hard for her to get to it. The error ended up being scored on the shortstop. Who should have gotten the error, the shortstop or me?
 
Jun 27, 2011
5,089
0
North Carolina
If you were a scorekeeper, I'd answer this in a different, more technical way.

But since you're a player, my answer is that you both are in error for arguing and trying to find fault and blame. You're teammates. You're in it together. Doesn't matter whose fault it was. Together, come up with a solution for the next time. Tell the shortstop - in a respectful non-blaming, non-bossy way - why you played it the way you did and sell her on why you think that's the best way to do it. If she has a better way, or some concerns on why that won't work, or why she can't get to the bag on time, listen to it. Find a solution. Engage the coach if necessary. The goal is to get better, not win an argument, and certainly not to finger-point, IMHO.
 

Greenmonsters

Wannabe Duck Boat Owner
Feb 21, 2009
6,168
38
New England
E-2 in the official score book. By definition, it's your error, just have to accept it even though you did your job. Runner goes, catcher throws - someone needs to be at the bag to catch the ball when it arrives. At second base, it could be the 2B or SS, but either way it's a very fine line as to when they should break for the bag - they need to break early enough from their original position in order to get to the base in the nick of time, but as late as possible so that they don't open up half the infield for the hitter to poke one through This requires teamwork and practice to get the exact timing down as it will vary due to the fielder's original position and each catcher's pop time.

Arguing about who's fault it is, particularly during a game, is not good teamwork!
 
Oct 30, 2014
292
18
Seattle
Gabby, I know you are in high school and I truly don't say this to be condescending but it very petty to be arguing errors ever - especially in the dugout. You should be work together to win the game and figure out how to make the play together the next time, not worrying about who has to take the knock in the scorebook. With a score of 12-10 over 3+ innings it seems both teams could use a bit of improvement defensively.
 
Nov 29, 2009
2,975
83
Sounds like your SS is either too slow to cover the bag or was sleeping at her position. Catchers are trained not wait for the SS to be there for the throw. They are working with about a .3 of second window to get the runner out. You did the absolute right thing. I would put that one 100% on your SS for not getting her backside to the base on time. If she has to, tell her cheat a couple of steps towards 2nd base without leaving early.

Your SS should NEVER have to tell you to wait for her. If she can't get there on time I would speak to the coach about working with her to train her to get there on time or put someone else there who can get the job done. Arguing in the dugout does nothing to help the situation.

Unfortunately, it goes in the books as an error on the throw. Scorekeeping does not allow judgement for lack of skill or speed. IE: The pop-up that has 3 fielders all standing there looking at each other while the ball drops fair untouched is a hit.

Another thought crossed my mind as I'm typing this. Are your skills better than your teammates and they can't play the game at the same speed you do? You may need to move to a team that is closer to your level of play if that's the case.
 
Jun 12, 2015
3,848
83
If she never touched the ball, and you made a good throw, does anyone get an error? I thought mental errors or just not being fast enough were not scored as errors?
 
Feb 4, 2015
641
28
Massachusetts
If she never touched the ball, and you made a good throw, does anyone get an error? I thought mental errors or just not being fast enough were not scored as errors?

I was thinking same thing. Why is this not a stolen base with no error? Same as SparkyGuy's pop-up analogy. Dropped tag or bad throw would be an error, but this is no play and isn't clear if runner advanced to 3b, which would then require an error assigned.

I also agree with others' comments that the players should have been discussing how to get the out next time instead of blaming each other in the dug-out.
 
May 17, 2012
2,804
113
Agree 'Sparky Guy' it's the SS fault but an error on the catcher. In what world would the catcher 'wait' for the SS?

The SS would get an earful from me and would be sitting on the bench if she did it again. Just do your job.
 
Dec 5, 2012
4,143
63
Mid West
SS needs to have one eye on the runners at the release of the pitch...Technically the E is on you. Even though she wasn't at her spot in time.
 
Jun 27, 2011
5,089
0
North Carolina
I was thinking same thing. Why is this not a stolen base with no error? Same as SparkyGuy's pop-up analogy. Dropped tag or bad throw would be an error, but this is no play and isn't clear if runner advanced to 3b, which would then require an error assigned.

I also agree with others' comments that the players should have been discussing how to get the out next time instead of blaming each other in the dug-out.

If she never touched the ball, and you made a good throw, does anyone get an error? I thought mental errors or just not being fast enough were not scored as errors?

Runner advanced to second on a stolen base, but runner advanced to third on an error. You have to explain ('score') every base advancement.

If there is no one there to catch the throw, then it is not a good throw, therefore an error. I'm not blaming the catcher. That's for the coach to decide. Just explaining how a scorekeeper would define that as a physical error.
 

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