Team hopping

Fastpitch_Dad said:

Moving to the big name org at 10u/12u is a lazy (albeit tempting) approach to choosing a team. You get a pass on your first team, after that parents should learn to be proactive in finding the right teamS before tryout season. My attitude is to choose the best team fit and take it yr by yr at this age and help her enjoy the sport.
My DD had the opportunity to join a new big name org team (college connections...blah.blah.blah) with coaches that I knew and respected but we ended up choosing a closer no-name team with coaches and players that was a better fit for what MY DD needed THIS year. My thought is that if she is good enough and desires to play college then she can make the big name teams later when the other kids burn out or she just beats them out.

Of course there are just people that buy cars every 3 months so is it a surprise they move their kids on different teams just as often?

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This is how I feel. We played on a bigger name A-level team last year and it just wasn't FUN. It was a lot of pressure, and my kid is mostly oblivious to that, but most of her teammates weren't. I never saw laughing or smiling during games; they did not seem to be having any fun. We thought hard about it and decided IF she decides she wants to play in college, BIG IF, we can transition to a bigger name in 14U. Before then, it doesn't really matter where she plays as long as it's good competition and she's the 1 or 2 pitcher. This fall has been probably the most fun we've ever had with softball - her as a player, DH as a coach, and me just as the cheering mom. I see her doing a little dance and laughing in the circle and I have no doubt we made the right call. If we'd continued the way we were going it's a lot more likely 14U wouldn't even be a thing, because she'd get sick of it before then.

CoogansBluff said:

Curious to know what we mean by team hopping. Does anyone look down on players who have played on 5 teams in 5 years? Mine has, but that's not why I'm asking.

Are you talking about players/families who leave mid-season? Or after the fall? Or players/families who play for a new team every year?

I'm slow to judge players/families that jump teams. I want to hear their story. Players jump because their former teams split or fell apart. Players jump because they age out and the rest of the team stayed back. They jump because they've out-grown their former team. They jump because some teams are just toxic and need to be abandoned. It's tough finding the right fit, and I'm not going to judge a player of family who has had trouble finding it until I hear more about it.

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Definitely good to make sure you're defining team jumping. I don't see changing clubs at the end of the season as team jumping. That's just a move that you are making because you feel it's best for your kid, and it's nobody else's business. Of course it's a huge bummer when good teams split up - or when girls announce that they're leaving the team before the season has ended - but eventually everybody gets over it and the dust does settle.

There are always those top of the pyramid clubs that most girls aspire to. And why? Maybe prestige, maybe the opportunity to play with the best of the best, but mostly recruiting. The proof is in the pudding there.

Me_and_my_big_mouth said:

... but mostly recruiting. The proof is in the pudding there.

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You may want to take a hard look at those teams and find out which ones were actually involved in the recruiting process and which ones picked up players after all the work was done. You may find out you have bought in to one of the biggest myths in softball.

The big names around here are a revolving door. I just found out our spring team (a biggish name, not one of the big 3) dissolved after a bunch of players left for other teams. Another local biggish name 10U team dissolved also. The two REALLY big names are sucking up all the best players (how many #1 quality pitchers one team needs, I do not know, but I wouldn't want my DD to be one of 5 or 6 of those at this age). Those teams have such high turnover. You'd think if playing for them was so awesome, they'd be able to hang onto more of their players for longer. The team we played for last fall only has 3 girls they started with a year ago, and has lost several more they picked up this year already. I told DH unless something really insane happens we stay right where we are at least through 12U. I can't take any more of the drama.

riseball said:

You may want to take a hard look at those teams and find out which ones were actually involved in the recruiting process and which ones picked up players after all the work was done. You may find out you have bought in to one of the biggest myths in softball.

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As we are learning in real time, this statement couldn't be more true. We do watch the rosters and see where girls come from and when they committed/verballed.

The issue, though, is this goofy Catch-22: Did the girl get her phone calls to college coaches answered because she is affiliated with the club, or did the club bring the girl on because she is a stud and it will attract more studs and/or more revenue/notoriety for the club? One stud who is already recruited and even plays for free is a huge marketing tool for the club because most fine families never realize what actually happened. And of course the stud's family is thrilled to let her change teams because she's already committed and doesn't need to pay all the money for the team fees. Win-win.

We have discovered that our daughter's own efforts seem to have gotten her a little notice - and our club is mildly supportive of her efforts. By that, I mean that they will happily speak with a coach who shows up to watch her. They will sing her praises, and they will give coaches their number. They have a good website, and they encourage a video and recruiting site. All great things.

Where I have been left a little flat is as far as the networking that gets done - and that's where the clout of the big orgs can really be an assist. If a college coach will answer the phone or return a call to Mr. Joe Blow with XYZ Super Platinum Elite, but won't return the call to Mr. Joe Schmo with PDQ Super Gold Elite, then all things being equal the club with the most connections is where most girls want to be. It's important to ask about that stuff when you have a daughter who is entering into the recruiting years, right? Which colleges do you have a relationship with, as a club? Which college coaches trust you when you say, "I gotta girl you just have to see"? Some clubs have settled themselves nicely into a DIII and JUCO machine, and are perfectly contented with that. There is a huge need for that and it serves a very important purpose for those girls who have parallel goals.

The problem happens when the girls aspire for more and aren't feeling supported or encouraged in their efforts. Imagine overhearing your recruiting coordinator say, "We really don't have any DI girls in this club." Well, if you are a parent of a 14u Princess who just sent 47 emails to DI schools, you're hitting the pavement like it's a trampoline and you (and your girl) aren't looking back. Now whether their calculated risk will be rewarded or not, remains to be seen. Sadly, it's less about "team" and more about "I" as the college gears start grinding.

Apologies for hijacking the thread. Just wanted to clarify what team jumping means to me, as opposed to finding the right fit for the kid.

Well, it's my thread and I like a good hijack so no problem.

Maybe I'm wrong but I feel like if your child wants to play in college, she's going to have to work for it anyway. Make the contacts, do the leg work. Surely colleges don't only recruit from 3 organizations in my state. If your kiddo is good enough to play in college and willing to put in the leg work to get there, I would think she'd find a place to play even if she's never on one of the big 3. But what do I know, my kid is 10U and I haven't even begun to think about what's involved in recruiting. I've read a few threads here and there and they mostly make me feel tired. haha

grcsftbll said:

Well, it's my thread and I like a good hijack so no problem.

Maybe I'm wrong but I feel like if your child wants to play in college, she's going to have to work for it anyway. Make the contacts, do the leg work. Surely colleges don't only recruit from 3 organizations in my state. If your kiddo is good enough to play in college and willing to put in the leg work to get there, I would think she'd find a place to play even if she's never on one of the big 3. But what do I know, my kid is 10U and I haven't even begun to think about what's involved in recruiting. I've read a few threads here and there and they mostly make me feel tired. haha

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LOL, great now I don't feel so bad! Isn't it about time for quincy to show up with an epic non sequitur, anyway? I just set the table for it.

And you're right about doing the work if they want to play in college, but it isn't about being good enough - it's about being seen. Many more regional teams in our area don't get the invites to the big showcases, even though they have girls who are every bit as good. It really is, sadly, a brand recognition thing. Go to the big schools' rosters, find out what travel teams are represented. Check out Goldfastpitch.com - look at the verbals happening and see what teams they're recruiting from. By 16u and 18u, that old pond is pretty tiny.

10u sounds young now, but at the rate things are going, you'll be facing recruiting situations at 12u more and more frequently! (And I'm only slightly exaggerating).

Of course the alternative is always camps; but if your money tree is as small and finicky as mine, you aren't going to be jet-setting around the country for dd to, "See if she gets a good vibe" from random coaches or teams. You'll want her to have an idea of what she wants. DIII? DI? NAIA? Great - now we find a club who will help dd achieve her goals. It's like anything else in life: hard work gets you in the race, but networking/marketing puts you out front.

So (wait for the tie): the best club teams will have better connections, which will get dd seen, which may or may not work out better for her.

Or, she might just be a bratty little Princess who jumps around because her parents are nightmares and she's a chip off the ol' blockhead, in which case even the DFP Super Platinum Elite team can't help her. <---- And that right there is what I call a Team Jumper.

We decided this weekend we should add "Elite Gold" to our name so we can win more. bwahahaha

I've seen both sides of the team-shopping vs. looking for opportunity debate this year. It's really hard to judge without knowing something about the situation, so I'm with Coogan's on the issue of giving the kid the benefit of the doubt. When you do know parents who are always looking for the next biggest thing then you look at this issue much differently, though.

The "team hopping" issue is rampant and interesting. Though there are several different reasons one I haven't seen here is the teams themselves. Especially at the 10-12U level. For most this is the entry level and most parents just don't know or have the ability to properly vet coaches before committing to a team. Most are coming from rec ball and we all know travel ball is a different beast all together. After you have been in travel for a while you quickly learn how to the process works. Many coaches out there are snake oil salesmen, but a lot of parents are too lol. They make commitments and promises that they simply can't keep. Now, if a coach commits to a player and things just don't work out that's one thing, but the problem is many know they can't deliver to begin with. That being said sometimes you really don't know a team until you get on it. It's kind of like marriage when they say you can date for 6 years, but you really don't know someone until you live with them.

Everyone thinks they want to be on that upper echelon team, but when they get there they become disappointed. Many times it's because there is a lot of expectation and pressure, and many kids are just not wired to handle that, or it's just not their cup of tea. Other times it's that there DD's simply aren't quite good enough to be a starter and get a lot of innings. Winning is great but at what cost. Some are fine sitting the bench as long as they can be part of a winning team. Others don't care if they win or lose as long as they get to play a lot. While others love to win, but need to play a lot or it doesn't matter. That being said when parents finally find the team at the peak of their kids playing ability that's when they truly settle in to what's the best fit, and unfortunately sometimes it takes a few teams to get it right. One thing that will go a long way towards curbing this problem is honesty on both the coaches and parents parts. The good thing is that there truly is a team for every player, you just have to find it.