What would it take to get your daughter on my team?

GunnerShotgun said:

Just playing devils advocate but what does your HC know? If I am the coach recruiting your DD I am going to ask her who her HC is and if I don't know him try to understand what they teach.

It will be stressful for the me if the HC is teaching something that is at odds w/what I teach.

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That's a fair question. I'm not saying this it's right or wrong for a player to see things this way, just pointing out how my DD sees it.

Most recently, I have been her hitting coach. She realizes that it's not going to work to be on a team where the coach is actively trying to change something that she doesn't believe should be changed. On her last team, the coaches wanted to change her to a no-stride approach, change her grip and stance (even though she led the team in batting average and extra-base hits). They didn't ''actively'' try to change her, just suggested it for a spell, so there was no issue. But if they had insisted, that would've been a problem because she would've felt conflicted between what she and I believed and what her coaches believed.

There also was the case I mentioned in the OP - the coach who wanted her to swing down and cut under the ball. That was a deal-breaker. It wasn't just me. It was her.

But I can see your point of view and how she (and me, her dad) might raise red flags for you as a coach. But keep in mind that she would be open-minded to many changes in her hitting. But there are some changes where she and I would draw the line. And she and I would be willing to be up front about that to the coach.

My dd has only been with 2 orgs, and the second one sprung from the first. Everything I have read about problems girls have had with new teams. I am so happy we never had to go through any of the tryout BS. My dd was invited to tryout at 8 for a local org. She played with them for the 10u, 12u, 14u and a few tourneys with the 18u. A coach formed his own 16u team and this is her second year with them. The coaches all knew what she could do and where she played best, and its been so much nicer then the experiences I have read about.

But if you want my dd to join your team, you better have a good idea on how to teach fielding and catching. My dd is a pitcher and I want her to have the most help possible by her teammates being able to field the ball. #1 thing to me.

YOCOACH said:

Gunner, no disrespect, but If his DD is hitting 17 HR's, batting .591 avg and has an OBP of .750 and a slugging+OBP of 1.77 in the same year, why would you want to change anything? Just playing devil's advocate to yours. Obviously the coach wants his DD for many reasons. One of the most important as far as I'm concerned is her stick. Thus, why would any coach, being in their right mind, want to change the swing for which they gave her an offer?

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You and I are in agreement, if the player can hit/field/pitch at a high level a coach would be a idiot to try and change them (even though I know coaches that try and do this).

These players are few and far between.

GunnerShotgun said:

You and I are in agreement, if the player can hit/field/pitch at a high level a coach would be a idiot to try and change them (even though I know coaches that try and do this).

These players are few and far between.

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At a certain age, there are kids who can get by strictly on athletic ability. Sometimes those kids hit 500 in spite of their poor form. Sometimes they can field the ball and throw harder then anyone else even with bad form. Eventually those kids are passed by because the other kids catch up in size, strength and ability, but have better technique. It is a coaches responsibility to teach the kid who is good in spite of herself the proper techniques so that she can get the most out of her natural ability.

This might not be the case with your dd, but it is an example of why a coach would try to "change" them.

Although its not likely the case based on the stats reported above (wow!), the primary question I have about successfull players is whether the mechanics they have used to achieve that success will limit their success at their intended next level of play. If the mechanics aren't sound IMO, then I am doing them a major disservice not to make them aware of that. After that, its entirely up to them whether they want my help to improve or not.

ETA - Was writing this before I saw China's excellent post.

Greenmonsters said:

Although its not likely the case based on the stats reported above (wow!), the primary question I have about successfull players is whether the mechanics they have used to achieve that success will limit their success at their intended next level of play. If the mechanics aren't sound IMO, then I am doing them a major disservice not to make them aware of that. After that, its entirely up to them whether they want my help to improve or not.

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What coach doesn't think his/her way is the correct way? The problem is, there are a lot of coaches out there who are flat out wrong in some of the things they think they are right in. And, having coached years and years and years isn't a sufficient condition for having all the right stuff or knowing what's best. So, when a coach thinks (from his/her perspective), "If the mechanics aren't sound IMO, then I am doing them a major disservice not to make them aware of that." he/she may be dead wrong. That is, what he/she thinks is in the player's long-term interest may not actually be what's in her best interest.

I've never met a coach that actually new everything there is to know. But then again, given I only know a fraction of all there is to know on coaching, how would I ever be able to tell if someone else is close to having all there is to know?

China and GM, at the expense of possibly high-jacking the thread, I posted those stats with the thought that others would assume correct mechanics for hitting as far as I and this forum are concerned.

Yes, I know...Assume=A$$ out of U and Me

YOCOACH said:

China and GM, at the expense of possibly high-jacking the thread, I posted those stats with the thought that others would assume correct mechanics for hitting as far as I and this forum are concerned.

Yes, I know...Assume=A$$ out of U and Me

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Yep. If them weren't t-ball stats or compiled in coach pitch, then I think its probably a pretty safe assumption that the hitter is doing something right!

Doug Romrell said:

What coach doesn't think his/her way is the correct way? The problem is, there are a lot of coaches out there who are flat out wrong in some of the things they think they are right in. And, having coached years and years and years isn't a sufficient condition for having all the right stuff or knowing what's best. So, when a coach thinks (from his/her perspective), "If the mechanics aren't sound IMO, then I am doing them a major disservice not to make them aware of that." he/she may be dead wrong. That is, what he/she thinks is in the player's long-term interest may not actually be what's in her best interest.

I've never met a coach that actually new everything there is to know. But then again, given I only know a fraction of all there is to know on coaching, how would I ever be able to tell if someone else is close to having all there is to know?

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We agree on the problem Doug, a lot of coaches don't know the "what" and fewer know "how" to teach it effectively. There is no doubt in my mind that the "what" i.e., the ultimate objective and benchmark, is the elite MLB swing. I don't think that can be argued anymore. Technology and slo-mo video let us apply the Hanson Principal and unequivocably put an end to unsupported beliefs and historical fallacies. The ladies aren't at that point, and not even all MLBers are there! IMO, Bustos is the closest and the best well-known reference to use for the ladies. However, from a more practical standpoint, if they look more like Bustos than the typical HS hitter and aren't overmatched by 65-70 mph speeds, then they probably are doing a lot more right than wrong and don't need to be significantly revamped. As far as "how" you get them there more effectively and efficiently, well, that's why people visit forums like DFP to question, discuss, and keep expanding the knowledge base.

Any HC who tries to change an accomplished hitter early on for a new player to their team is STUPID.

To coach a new player changes, when they are already a good hitter, takes understanding who the player is, how she thinks, and is a process which takes easily six months just to formulate an effective personalized plan.

Then it is minute changes, both in the body and mind, to reach a calculated end result.

Any coach who starts out early with giving my DD changes in her hitting style, a stroke developed since the age of 4, and carefully cultivated by a succession of great hitting coaches for over a decade. He will not see her again.

For example, my hitter is a "no stride" hitter. Very powerful. Some coaches insist on teaching a generous stride. Firmly believe it is necessary. While others do not, understanding that when you view DD's in super slow motion the hip turn is very quick and powerful with just a 6" (or less) short step. Yet the ones who strongly believe in a good stride, are the exact same ones who insist on changing her at the very first hitting practice, without even seeing her hit in a game ... STUPID. and never see her again, except from the opposite dugout, and usually not pretty for them.